working with a trainer

Topic for older horses and older riders
demi
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working with a trainer

Postby demi » Thu Sep 14, 2017 3:37 pm

Now that Rocky is getting back into work I have started thinking about working with a trainer. We all know how hard it can be to find a trainer under the best of circumstances, but being senior citizen makes me even more skeptical of finding one.

I have an appointment next Thursday with a young woman in my area. I will see her teach and train. The facility is a recent renovation of an old facility and I haven't seen it yet.

For my own situation, I need 1.) someone close to home, 2.)with a covered arena, and 3) someone who doesn't yell.

Any thoughts on what other seniors would want in a trainer?

Tsavo
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Re: working with a trainer

Postby Tsavo » Thu Sep 14, 2017 4:00 pm

I agree it is so important to audit as many lessons as you can before choosing someone. I would ask the other people how much they advanced and in what time frame. You may want a person experienced in rehab. Ask what rehab they have done and try to figure out if they know what they are doing or are just pretending.

Good luck.
Last edited by Tsavo on Fri Sep 15, 2017 1:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.

kande50
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Re: working with a trainer

Postby kande50 » Fri Sep 15, 2017 9:38 am

Try older trainers, as they usually have a much better handle on what older riders need, assuming that they're still riding, or at least rode into their dotage. They're often better instructors too, simply because they've been doing it for a lot longer so have more experience.

What I've learned is that I'm much happier spending a lot more resources on less frequent lessons with someone really good (by my standards), than I am when I compromise and spend fewer resources so that I can take more lessons.

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Chisamba
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Re: working with a trainer

Postby Chisamba » Sun Sep 17, 2017 2:00 pm

I would suggest that you avoid a trainer who is belittling or harsh, but you might not mind a person who yells if they are simply trying to make themselves herd.

I try to find some one who has taken a horse where i want to go, is confident but kind, and who both listens and has reasoned opinions

texsuze
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Re: working with a trainer

Postby texsuze » Wed Sep 20, 2017 8:18 pm

I couldn't imagine working with someone who yells. Do you mean yells in anger or frustration?

Not sure where you are in TX, Demi, but PM me if you are up near Dallas, since I rode there for several years. Might have a suggestion or two for you for trainers.

Abby Kogler
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Re: working with a trainer

Postby Abby Kogler » Thu Sep 21, 2017 3:31 pm

You want a trainer who knows more than you do >;-> One who understands the laws of horsie physics, and the way the rider body applies the aids. You want someone who understands the aids and can tell what your body is doing and knows how to correct it.

Being nice, on time, and kind natured is also a plus >;->

IMO, medals or show records are no guarantee that the person is a good instructor. Its nice when you have the insights that a successful competition career can give, but if the insights are connected to someone who can translate them in to your body and how it affects your horses movement, then all the medals in the world are not going to help you.

I also have friends in TX who ride...where are you?

demi
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Re: working with a trainer

Postby demi » Fri Sep 22, 2017 4:07 am

texsuze wrote:I couldn't imagine working with someone who yells. Do you mean yells in anger or frustration?

Not sure where you are in TX, Demi, but PM me if you are up near Dallas, since I rode there for several years. Might have a suggestion or two for you for trainers.


I have worked with a couple of trainers who yell to get a point across. They were not BNT's.

PM'd you.

demi
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Re: working with a trainer

Postby demi » Fri Sep 22, 2017 4:09 am

[quote="Abby Kogler"

I also have friends in TX who ride...where are you?[/quote]

I'm in Central Texas.

demi
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Re: working with a trainer

Postby demi » Fri Sep 22, 2017 4:47 am

I think I found someone today!! I watched her teach lessons on two completely opposite horses, with two different types of riders. She had a very different approach to each horse. She gave good, detailed, easy to understand instructions to the riders, and the riders were able to carry out the instructions. She gave the same detailed attention to both riders. One rider was more advanced, and more coordinated and the trainer gave her appropriately more difficult work. The less coordinate rider was still given the same attention and detailed instructions, just easier stuff.

She had a sound system that worked well. She wore a headset, riders heard through speakers.

I watched her ride one of her horses and they had an obviously good relationship. Her horse, a PSG level, was relaxed and confident. I liked the way he responded to her. She had two big dogs that laid by me while she was teaching, and I noticed a couple of times when she said "That was good" to her student, the dogs would wag their tails! That's a good sign in my book.

In addition, She is GP on centerline scores, with a 70+ %. She has gold, silver and bronze medals and has taken at least one horse from the start all the way to GP, and several to PSG.

She is having Betsy Steiner for a three day clinic, then she has the championships, and after that I will schedule my first lesson. Her website is not functioning at the moment, so I couldn't check who she trained with and all that stuff, but I like her anyway. Her facility is nice. Mirrors and a big covered arena, with three full walls and one side open. A good arrangement for Texas weather. Good footing, not too deep or to shallow. Good parking for easy trailering in. And only 23 minutes from home.

kande50
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Re: working with a trainer

Postby kande50 » Fri Sep 22, 2017 10:45 am

demi wrote:
I have worked with a couple of trainers who yell to get a point across. They were not BNT's.


I'm fine with yelling as long as it doesn't get personal. I'm especially good with it if it seems like my instructor is really getting into what we're doing, comes across as enthusiastic about it, and is just as enthusiastic when we get it.

Animated instructors are fine with me as long as they're willing to go along with how much I think my horse should have to do, although I can usually control that by speaking up when I think he's had enough and/or scheduling shorter lessons.

Tsavo
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Re: working with a trainer

Postby Tsavo » Fri Sep 22, 2017 11:33 am

demi wrote:In addition, She is GP on centerline scores, with a 70+ %. She has gold, silver and bronze medals and has taken at least one horse from the start all the way to GP, and several to PSG.


One question I have learned to ask beyond all the ones you did which are great by the way is how many students has should brought up the levels? I have worked with people who brought double digits to the upper levels and handful to FEI and I have worked with people who never brought anyone to the upper levels despite years of training with her.

I went to audit someone last year who is easily one of the most beautiful riders I have ever seen in my life. I watched her train her FEI horse and it was just a visual masterpiece. It's a combination of her body type and ability as far as I can tell. In contrast, the lessons were complete disasters and I had to keep picking my jaw up off the ground. That is one of the few times where I could not get out of somewhere quick enough and I had to keep thinking about how to leave as soon as possible without it seeming completely rude.

I hope it works out for you. It sounds like a great situation.

demi
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Re: working with a trainer

Postby demi » Fri Sep 22, 2017 1:31 pm

Tsavo, there are lots of questions will ask, but I didn't have enough time yesterday. I spent 3 hours there, and got as much out of it as I could. I truly understand that not all pretty riders, even with good GP scores, are not all good teachers. I will try to relate a personal experience and hope that anyone who reads it, will be open minded.

I first became interested in dressage in the very early 1980's after we moved to California. I had an excellent opportunity to work with Hilda, but I didn't like the way she sat on a horse! To me, all I could see was that all of her students sat the same way. She came every month to No. Ca where I was boarding and the woman who brought her in, is now professional and has currently trained numerous horses to GP, as have two of the other women who started with Hilda at the same time. I, on the other hand chose to clinic with one of Hilda's contemporaries who sat, as Cdk described it in one of his books, with "supreme elegance". We all know of Hilda's success. Probably few, with the exception of some older Californians, remember the other trainer.

I only trained with the other trainer for 2 years, monthly. I could see that it wasn't going anywhere, but neither, when I watched Hilda, could I relate to her methods. At the least, I learned by watching the other trainer, that by connecting my body to the horse in the same way that she did, I was physically in a position to have my aids felt by the horse. I had a young TB that responded beautifully at first. He progressed quickly but then became uncooperative. Essentially, the trainer said it was my fault, but she had the same problems when she got on him. I went to another trainer, who said I needed to be more firm with him. I took him to the local vet who found nothing. I considered going to Hilda. Then I hauled him to the best lameness vet I could find. My horse had navicular syndrome and I spent the next 8 years trying all the various treatments, under the vet's supervision. I hardly rode at all during that period so the fact is, that it didn't matter that I chose the pretty rider over the effective rider.

Now I am at a different place in my life. I don't care how fast a trainer can take a student correctly up the levels, because I know that so much more is involved. I am old and I am riding two older horses. We aren't going to progress rapidly. My concern is not that I will take them up the levels, but that I am able to keep them as healthy, happy, willing partners, and do a little correct dressage along the way. Whatever way that may be.

This forum, as well as the training forum has been very helpful for me. This is a unique BB, and being able to discuss the things we discuss, with out fear of judgement (for the most part :) ) is something that has developed over the time DDBB has been up. The older version of the BB and some of the other BB's didn't/don't work the same way. I appreciate what we have here and it has become a big part of my "dressage" training.

Thanks everyone, and Chancellor, especially!

demi
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Re: working with a trainer

Postby demi » Fri Sep 22, 2017 11:51 pm

I should add that I have great respect for Hilda. She is amazing. I have noticed a couple of recent photos of her and found them motivating and enjoyable to look at....

calvin
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Re: working with a trainer

Postby calvin » Mon Oct 16, 2017 8:57 pm

Demi,

This is a very, very positive and promising development for you. (And you are not "old", just "older"!) It IS all about the journey for some of us, and if we are lucky enough to be able to continue riding in our 60's and beyond, we really want to have enjoyable lessons. There is no need for stress (including yelling). We can be serious, committed to learning, committed to ensuring the best welfare for our horses, and still enjoy the learning process. I know I am still taking lessons and making progress on my older horse. Please give us a report in due course, and know the positive energy of this BB is with you!

On a side note, you may recall that I bought 2 yearlings when Sharon Garner was closing out GCF. Both youngsters have found fabulous new owners in the intervening years. One of the yearlings, now 6 years old (!), was selected to attend the Ontario, Canada Charles Hester symposium next weekend. Very exciting for all concerned!

Nancy

demi
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Re: working with a trainer

Postby demi » Tue Oct 17, 2017 1:43 pm

Hey Calvin! Thanks for the encouragement. I had my first lesson yesterday and it was wonderful! I reported on the goals and progress thread in the training forum.

I do remember your Hanoverians and they sound very exciting! Keep us posted on the symposium. And remember how we like pictures of pretty horses!!!

How are your horse’s itchy ears doing? I need to update Emma’s sweet itch condition on the ver forum.

piedmontfields
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Re: working with a trainer

Postby piedmontfields » Tue Oct 17, 2017 2:00 pm

I just turned 50 last week, so I hope it is fine to join this part of the board! lol

Demi, I am very happy for your trainer find! I would love to have that situation near me. I am too old to put up with poor communication skills and too experienced to put up with poor training/methods.

demi
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Re: working with a trainer

Postby demi » Tue Oct 17, 2017 10:54 pm

Please join us, Piedmont, even tho you’re only 50!

I thought you had a local trainer to work with. It is so helpful to have a trainer but as we know, it can be difficult to find the right one. We have several local dressage trainers but for various reasons they just weren’t right. The trainer I found just recently moved to my town and I only found out about it from reading the CoTH forum. In recent years it has become too stressful for me to trailer even an hour each way. New trainer is only 23 minutes and all easy roads. Plus she has a nice facility with a great enclosed, covered arena, with mirrors!

But the final clincher for me, is that she not only has great credentials, but her style is just what I need at this time.

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Re: working with a trainer

Postby Hayburner » Thu Oct 19, 2017 5:06 pm

I'm older too - I was lucky to have a very understanding trainer for my crazy assed mare and my insecurities. She never yelled at me, though I do think I frustrated her at times.

I recently took a couple lessons from a late 30 year old and she was very kind and understanding, she never yelled. She was very helpful and got that I hadn't been in the saddle for a long time and I needed support and instruction, not negativity.

I am now working with another trainer, who hasn't yelled yet, but I do know when I'm told to do something, I better do it....even if I don't want to.

I too would not like being yelled at or bullied, I'm not 15 years old nor am I aiming for the Olympics.

demi
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Re: working with a trainer

Postby demi » Tue Oct 24, 2017 12:29 pm

Hayburner wrote:I'm older too - I was lucky to have a very understanding trainer for my crazy assed mare and my insecurities. ....



My mare isn’t exactly “crazy a$$ed” :lol: but she is hot and I have insecurities, too. My new trainer is so good at building my confidence. I can’t believe how lucky I got!

piedmontfields
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Re: working with a trainer

Postby piedmontfields » Wed Oct 25, 2017 1:04 pm

I am really glad for you, Demi. I did work with someone who was good eyes on the ground and a good rider when I was out of town. However, I got tired of the teaching approach which tended to include a lot of comments like "the problem with you is..." "the problem with your horse is...". Oddly enough, I did not find that an inspiring or helpful orientation to fostering learning and growth! I did put up with it for awhile because my choices are limited.


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