Spinoff: Introducing the Flying Changes

[Ponichiwa]

Or flinging changes, if that's how you roll.

By the looks of things, the Introducing Counter Canter thread is slowly morphing into a discussion about flying changes. And from the sounds of things, there are quite a few of us who are currently in/near Flying Change Hell.

So let's chat about it. What are your prerequisites for the flying changes? What exercises have helped you? Do you want to wallow in communal sorrow? Let's do this.

[Amado]

I just wrote a huge post in that other thread, haha!

This is slightly off topic, but I find the mechanics of flying changes fascinating. I think we had a thread about this in the old forum - My biggest fear in the flying changes is the dreaded front/hind change, it's the one that you see a LOT in the hunter ring, if you aren't looking closely you will miss it. I was told by a hunter trainer recently, that is was usually "good enough" for the hunters. It's the one you often get when your horse is on the forehand, and leans into the change. It works if you only need one, (like when you are changing direction in the hunter ring) but it doesn't work if you are working towards tempi changes. I was told by one of my instructors that once a horse learns to do them that way, they are difficult to fix.

I found learning the mechanics of the change very useful - and watching videos to help my eye was great. Here's a good slow motion video that demonstrates a clean change:

http://youtu.be/iUgnXKK0ris

[piedmontfields]

OK, I'll play. Although I don't really feel that I am suffering during this period!

I am mostly letting my trainer work directly on the changes while I do the homework away from the changes that helps the changes. That said, I occasionally can't resist looking at them myself and they are getting easier and clearer for both mare and me. Miss mare is being very calm about the whole thing, which is great and also a tribute I think to our approach. I do much better working directly on changes out in the field where I have plenty of room to set up and energize. At some point I have to learn to do them in the arena! FYI, I have ridden changes on a very trained (dressage) horse before, but it has been years and I am not super experienced. So I count on eyes on the ground quite a bit.

Away from the changes, I am working on overall canter straightness, including the ability to move the shoulders and change flexion on any given lead. This includes CC, but we are not obsessed with CC if you know what I mean. I'm also doing a ton of w-c-w and what I call "any lead, any time" transitions on long straight lines. Also lots of 10 m circles at canter, plus spiraling in and out from a larger circle. Last night I tried for the first time transitioning down from 10 m canter circle to walk and then up to canter before a complete walk occurred. I'm not sure if that makes sense, but the aim is to pick up the canter again on the outside hind before you complete the all of the steps of walk. It is quick and it is hard, but little mare was starting making sense of it by the 3rd try.

Overall I am trying to make the canter aid/transition cleaner and quicker. A lot of this is fixing me!

[Amado]

I am mostly letting my trainer work directly on the changes while I do the homework away from the changes that helps the changes. That said, I occasionally can't resist looking at them myself and they are getting easier and clearer for both mare and me. Miss mare is being very calm about the whole thing, which is great and also a tribute I think to our approach. I do much better working directly on changes out in the field where I have plenty of room to set up and energize. At some point I have to learn to do them in the arena! FYI, I have ridden changes on a very trained (dressage) horse before, but it has been years and I am not super experienced. So I count on eyes on the ground quite a bit.

Yes, this. I only ever did them when I rode hunters, and I'd cross my fingers when I changed direction. I let the current western trainer introduce them, I worked on setting them up, but not asking for the changes in between our lessons. But before I went for help, our walk canter walks were good, I could pick up any lead, both on the straightaway and on the circle from a walk, I could collect his canter to almost a piroette canter, and I could move his shoulders around and change the flexion in his head and neck while staying in the canter. The one thing I quit doing was the quick one step in between canter walk canter transitions - because he started throwing in that one little quick trot step when I started asking for the changes myself, before I got help from the western trainer. So that particular method didn't work for us.

[Ponichiwa]

I've found that schooling big working pirouettes is helping my mare. She's short-coupled (and short-statured, and sometimes short-tempered) and is so fast to get organized-- it's a challenge to keep her on the aids instead of jumping ahead of me. She's also very quick to "steal" the bend if she's not exactly on my seat. The working pirouettes give both of us a chance to get organized, and really put her haunches underneath her when I ask for a half-halt.

So it's been critical for me to get her in front of my leg and correctly responsive to a half-halt from my core. Then and only then do I have an icecube's chance in hell of getting a flying change that is correct and uphill. The alternative is a quick swap that has some... creativity to it.

I introduced the changes in 2-point when she was 4. We'd canter around a big arena or field and I'd ask for a change with a shift in my leading leg/weight whenever the canter felt ready. This was all well and good, until I was showing 1st level and got 4 flying changes in the single loop. Whoops.

[piedmontfields]

That is a good tip about the big working pirouette. I think this would help us, too.

My mare is also very quick to get on and off the aids---maybe that is really a curse of being a very handy, short-coupled horse.

[Amado]

I introduced the changes in 2-point when she was 4. We'd canter around a big arena or field and I'd ask for a change with a shift in my leading leg/weight whenever the canter felt ready. This was all well and good, until I was showing 1st level and got 4 flying changes in the single loop. Whoops.

[Amado]

We've got one good side (Left to right) that I can almost always get, the other (R-L) is coming along, I find I get it better if really think about keeping the impulsion, and make sure he is sort of up in his neck (that's probably not the right terminology) - that side also sometimes better if I do a bit of a half pass first, straighten, change the bend and change the lead. I'm sure there's a reason for that, but I couldn't tell you what it is!

[Ponichiwa]

We've got one good side (Left to right) that I can almost always get, the other (R-L) is coming along, I find I get it better if really think about keeping the impulsion, and make sure he is sort of up in his neck (that's probably not the right terminology) - that side also sometimes better if I do a bit of a half pass first, straighten, change the bend and change the lead. I'm sure there's a reason for that, but I couldn't tell you what it is!

Half pass to a straight line can get the shoulders pushing over into the new outside rein. If your horse is like mine, he gets a bit low with the left front (especially in the shoulder) in the canter. Half pass to the right convinces the horse to keep reaching with the left front instead of getting a bit stabby/up-and-down with it.

You may also find that shoulder-in right helps as well. Really, anything that helps them engage that sling of muscles around their sternum and pick up their brisket helps the quality of the canter improve, and helps the changes come easier.

[mld02004]

I ask on a diagonal line, after a very steep leg yield. My horse is a counter canter machine, so she doesn't really feel the need to change. Plus she's very agile to begin with (short coupled arab cross). If your horse is schooled in canter half pass, it's often a good exercise to ask for the change after half passing to the centerline (edited to add I see this was just mentioned!).

Sometimes they are clean, sometimes late behind. I also have to sort of jazz her up to get more activity behind or else she sort of runs out of gas mid-change.

[Flight]

I've got one side pretty good, the other a crazy kick up leg!
So, I'll be reading this thread closely

[piedmontfields]

Flight, FWIW, my mare's changes are very related to my good canter side. As in, right to left is harder than left to right (even though right canter is in some ways the weaker side for my mare). I am much stronger and more positioned on the right. Left is a lot of work for me.

[MidgetMustang]

I found myself nodding and commiserating to most of the issues mentioned.
My girl does a funky little skip change at this point-she sort of stalls and sticks a foot down in the middle of the change. Since I work alone most of the time, at this point we spend most of our time working on the pieces but not asking for the change (I really don't want her to learn it wrong and without eyes on the ground I sometimes struggle). She's wickedly smart and I'm pretty sure she thinks I'm quite stupid-she's worked out a much easier way to get from one lead to the other and I keep harping on her to do it the hard way.
In our last lesson my instructor had us: leg yield across the diagonal and ask at the wall (nope), CC to true canter on the circle (nope), C-W-C gradually decreasing the number of walk steps (meh...at least this helped to get the idea across that the goal was to get to the other lead), and finally he plopped a rail down and had us change over that. Not ideal but I think he was at his wits end
I started introducing pirouettes to help her sit and strengthen her hind end. Lots of changing gears in the canter to reinforce promptness off the aids, changes of bend, leg yields, half pass...
I've never taught a horse to change before-my last mare and I jumped a bunch so she just sort of had them. I'm pretty sure I'm not helping (or maybe helping too much?) since I feel awkward and uncoordinated. Sigh.

[mari]

Also there. Odin is FINALLY responsive to the aid and does a change when asked, but with a huge kick out behind and dumping his head between his knees (launching my bum out the saddle every damn time). This happens regardless of the quality of the canter beforehand. My poor neck and back will not last much longer. My jumping instructor now has me keeping his head up like a giraffe while asking for the change. Last few weeks have been very ... interesting. He is no longer so responsive to the leg, but we did get 2 clean changes yesterday, with me actually staying in the saddle.

[Flight]

Flight, FWIW, my mare's changes are very related to my good canter side. As in, right to left is harder than left to right (even though right canter is in some ways the weaker side for my mare). I am much stronger and more positioned on the right. Left is a lot of work for me.

Thanks, I will have to ponder more on this! It does my head in sometimes
Our left is our weaker side.

[piedmontfields]

I tried the large working pirouette tonight. That is clearly related to flying change prep! Thanks for the suggestion.

[Shadowfax]

I believe in starting the flying changes early. If done right they don't interfere with counter canter at all. If you think about it, equitation horses learn flying changes LONG before they learn to counter canter and they have to be just as solid in the counter canter as a dressage horse. While you see plenty of people at the local level flinging their horse onto the new lead using a corner as you go up in difficulty or to bigger shows this doesn't "fly" with a judge. A well scored flying change is done on the straightaway and is back to front. A late change or a flinging style change in a corner can mean the difference between a ribbon and no ribbon. Although hunter riders are looking for an unobtrusive flying change (not expressive and upright like a dressage change) the rest of their desires are the same.

It is all about the bend and the rider's aids. My grey mare had an auto change. Look in new direction, new opening rein, weight in new inside leg. When I was crooked and lost she'd do tempi changes until she got tired of my crap. If I rode better and maintained the correct bend she'd hold the counter lead.

I think people have trouble teaching the change because the horse spends so many years without it, or so many years counter cantering. Put the change on the horse when the horse is young, then don't mess with it or drill it much.

[klark_kent07]

I just started a thread on this very topic! I'm just starting them as well, am going to have trainer ride him for a week or 2 to help get the idea as she is very experienced and will start them so I can continue. I have only played with asking for an actual change a few times and have only got a change in front and nothing behind. Will have another play over the next week until my trainer is ready to take him but don't want to teach something that she will have to undo, so if they aren't happening at all I will leave it alone :/

[Ponichiwa]

Klark,

What happens when you put your leg on-- does he go faster over the ground or does the tempo increase? My money is on the former, which can help to separate the front end from the hind and disunite the changes. If you increase his tempo (without him covering more ground) from his normal status and keep jumping the hind end under, he'll a) get stronger, and b) have a better chance of getting clean changes.

My pony is the opposite, and gets quicker before she covers more ground. Keeping the tempo absolutely consistent has helped the changes go upwards instead of launching forwards and now they're bigger and expressive instead of frightening.

[klark_kent07]

Thanks Ponichiwa, yes he does get faster I guess and bigger. So I need quicker but not bigger?

[Ponichiwa]

You need to speed the tempo up and tuck the hind end underneath him every stride. I'm not talking choppy with feet flying everywhere-- but think about if every stride was 20% faster than his normal tempo. And then keep that tempo going for a couple figures. Make sure that you can transition from the trot or walk directly into the canter in that slightly quicker tempo every time, without him getting long and fast. Then you can start adding the changes back in.

Also this is hard stuff, so it's ok to take a break and work on something that both of you find easier/rewarding.

[exvet]

My girl does a funky little skip change at this point-she sort of stalls and sticks a foot down in the middle of the change. Since I work alone most of the time, at this point we spend most of our time working on the pieces but not asking for the change (I really don't want her to learn it wrong and without eyes on the ground I sometimes struggle). She's wickedly smart and I'm pretty sure she thinks I'm quite stupid-she's worked out a much easier way to get from one lead to the other and I keep harping on her to do it the hard way.

LOL has she been watching the stinker pony????? My riding instructor and coach call it the stutter step or change. My pony is so adept at using his underneck to do everything that I have had to teach him how to use his body properly. Work in hand has helped significantly in getting him to understand how to raise his forehand and lift his chest up through his withers and work through his back. I have been working mostly on piaffe and passage in hand, mixing in over fences work and so on. The other thing that has helped is working on solely getting him out to the hand and over the back. I will not let him change (we're talking all transitions but that includes the flying change in the school) if he tenses up or braces. Finally an exercise that we often go back to when he gets tense which usually happens in the tempis is a figure 8 exercise - counter canter on the 10 meter circle to the opposite counter canter on the 10 meter circle putting in a flying change going from one cc to the next. My pony is ALWAYS clean in this exercise which just proves that he can do it and I have to keep working on KEEPING HIM ON MY AIDS..................no small feat on the stinker who rewrites the chapters of his owners manual minute-by-minute.

As for basics or what is needed in order to begin is true good quality/pure canter with a decent jump to the collected canter and absolutely confirmed simple changes with the ability to stay relaxed throughout the entire transition.

[oldhag]

The biggest killer of changes is lack of confidence from the rider. Regardless of ability of the rider many horses change correctly from the first ask. Many others, again regardless of rider ability can take a couple of years of frustration before they 'get it.'

I'd say the only way to learn is to teach your horse yourself. Don't back off thinking it's late behind/flying without change/ bucking/kicking/bolting or generally trying to kill you. Get on with it, you learn through your mistakes!

[mld02004]

I found myself nodding and commiserating to most of the issues mentioned.
My girl does a funky little skip change at this point-she sort of stalls and sticks a foot down in the middle of the change. Since I work alone most of the time, at this point we spend most of our time working on the pieces but not asking for the change (I really don't want her to learn it wrong and without eyes on the ground I sometimes struggle). She's wickedly smart and I'm pretty sure she thinks I'm quite stupid-she's worked out a much easier way to get from one lead to the other and I keep harping on her to do it the hard way.
In our last lesson my instructor had us: leg yield across the diagonal and ask at the wall (nope), CC to true canter on the circle (nope), C-W-C gradually decreasing the number of walk steps (meh...at least this helped to get the idea across that the goal was to get to the other lead), and finally he plopped a rail down and had us change over that. Not ideal but I think he was at his wits end
I started introducing pirouettes to help her sit and strengthen her hind end. Lots of changing gears in the canter to reinforce promptness off the aids, changes of bend, leg yields, half pass...
I've never taught a horse to change before-my last mare and I jumped a bunch so she just sort of had them. I'm pretty sure I'm not helping (or maybe helping too much?) since I feel awkward and uncoordinated. Sigh.

My coach calls it the touch down. I find we need more jump in the canter (not faster) or else we can get that stutter step.

Completely agree with old hag...I find when I'm not confident enough we don't get the change, or only in front.

[galopp]

The tempo should not increase in changes (unless it is too slow in the first place because speed is the enemy of impulsion), but the energy should be kept (remember the standard of collection is reduced for (tempi) changes). The leg touches for the change, it does not push because that can easily create lateral movement and the hurrying. Half halt, and ask. Let the horse be more up and open (and never compressed or deep (which as talked about here can create kicking up/crookedness).

The earlier the changes are introduced (allowed) the easier they will be and free. If they happen, let them. Introducing cc later is simply keeping the impulsion, coming back, asking again. There is a number of ways to add them otherwise: from true c to cc with (gradually) decreasing number of walk strides. IF all the lateral work (si/counter si/renvers/travers) is in order (both straight ahead, and on circles and figure 8s, then The other is on a figure 8 from cc renvers to cc renvers (the horse will be straighter/the shoulders aligned). The use of travers on a circle (pirouette type) or half pass to a change can easily eaches the quarters to swing. The reason a horse is better with the changes after cc 10m circles is that it straightens the horse. Another way to propose them is changing over a fence. Always use uberstreichen after a change (early on) to reward the horse and allow the balance and calm.

When a horse gets more tense/runs, walk for as long as it takes (after a change) to calm the horse and restart. If they are too low, they must be up/open to jump through (even if is gasp too high).

For me LY is simply too problematic in canter, filling out the outside rein, perhaps..but crossing over w/o bend is easily imbalancing.

The way Klimke asked for changes was collect/straignten on the short side, and then rider forward for the changes.

[Amado]

I have always wondered if using a pole for the changes might teach the horse to change in front first.