September and October Goals and Progress

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StraightForward
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September and October Goals and Progress

Postby StraightForward » Sun Sep 03, 2017 3:56 pm

Time for a new thread again; summer flew by!

Hoping for a cooling trend soon; it's supposed to hit 101 today.

Annabelle will probably be off for another week after hanging her leg in a fence last week. Her hock is still a bit puffy and warm, but showing a little improvement each day, and her bodywork session on Friday helped to put some other things right. In the meantime, we'll do a little groundwork, including work on ground tying.

Since she was out of commission for most of August, September will probably focus mostly on regaining the bit of muscle she was putting on in July.

Simple green stuff like improving steering, rhythm and baby lateral work, catching the correct leads and insisting on a nice forward, marching walk will be the order of the day. I'm hoping to introduce some tiny crossrails in October just to change things up a bit. The last event derby of the season is in mid-October, so I'd like to get to that, even if we're just doing the ground poles division.
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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby Moutaineer » Sun Sep 03, 2017 10:33 pm

Rehab, rehab, and a bit more rehab here. We are pretty much having to make up a program as we go along, so our goal is to be trotting comfortably by the end of October.

Rode him again yesterday, and he's got his big swinging walk back. That'll help start to build a bit of muscle.

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby Flight » Mon Sep 04, 2017 1:02 am

Be able to get the Spanish walk under saddle. We can do one side at a time. Gain some strength back in my position after this ACL reconstruction, and lose the weight I've gained - 4.5 kg in 6 weeks!!

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby demi » Mon Sep 04, 2017 1:08 am

SF, I am looking forward to the cooling trend also. I hope Sept and Oct prove to be productive months for you and Annabelle, and for all of our horses!

Mountaineer, so good to see you back on Laddie! Are you going to continue with Walker? I am in a similar situation only reversed. Emma is on hold with the sweet itch thing so I am putting Rocky back to work.

I will post some pics of Em's poor ears and tail.She rubs a lot and I can tell she is frustrated. She acts like she wants me to help her, nickering pitifully when she sees me coming out to the barn... I know that some horses have it much worse, but Emma is already a complicated horse that to try and work her with this distraction I am afraid is asking to much...

So for Rocky, I have had several very nice rides using just a steady shortened stride (see the thread!) so am planning to continue it for a while. It does put her in a nice frame of mind. I won't be using the steady shortened trot as my warm up. My warm up has been 10-15 walk on long rein and then another 10-15 minutes of the steady shortened trot. I plan to do nothing more than this for 2-3 weeks and see what happens.

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby Kyra's Mom » Mon Sep 04, 2017 5:26 am

Well...I also vote for a cool down. Kyra is shedding buckets of summer hair and with temps in the 90's, I don't think the winter fuzz will be too comfortable.

I really hope I can get back to doing some work with her. Family stuff has really killed any training time. I am hoping it eases up a bit as I get my uncle's estate lined out and my Dad levels out a bit. He has dementia and was getting quite cantankerous for my Mom. I am sure his brother's death did not help even though they were not particularly close.

I will probably have to stick to ground work for awhile. The stress of the last month seems to have kicked up the butt pain a bit and I just know that riding won't help at the moment. I have been told by another that had this surgery that one is definitely in it for the long haul and you can often wonder whether it was the right thing to do. I will probably start with hand walks to improve both of our fitness. Since I don't have hills handy, I want to get her back to doing poles for her stifle strength. Hopefully soon, I can try riding again and get in some miles on the track before the weather turns wet and we are stuck in the indoor.

At the barn I board at, they have good hay (home grown) and good space where my horse is out and can get movement 24/7 but it's one deficiency is the footing. I was going to visit a couple other barns in August but never got around to it when my uncle died so at this point, we are probably stuck where we are for the winter as barns with indoors fill up fast. I will reassess things in the Spring. If I am still having physical problems and not able to ride like I would like to...be able to school walk/trot and canter for 30-60 minutes at least...I may decide to sell her. It isn't something I want to do but she is too nice and too nicely trained to just sit in a dry lot and do nothing. NOT a goal I want to achieve and heck...that is next Spring, not September and October right?

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby Dresseur » Mon Sep 04, 2017 2:36 pm

I have some lofty goals for these next two months. But, it's also all very dependent on what my coach feels we're ready for (Gala and I). This Thursday, I am going to run through the I-1 test again to see how it rides. I have been schooling the movements here and there. Andrea feels strongly that we do not drill movements, but work on the basics, then ride through a movement to see where the holes are. I appreciate that approach because it's very systematic and it because she breaks down the highest level movements down into their basic elements, I start to get an idea as to how to train those movements as well. And, it seems like progress magically happens when I reattempt something a month or two later... but I digress.

In any case, if the run-through goes well, I'll be showing at that level very soon. Ideally, I have the usual issues at the expected places (the changes, while better, still get crooked) and I'm able to show I-1 before the end of the year and then work toward GP all winter. But, as we all know, nothing with horses ever goes to plan!!

Speaking of, I'm sure some have noticed that I haven't posted about Miro in a long while. Whatever he did in the pasture ended up being a bigger deal than initially thought - so, while diagnostics have continued to show zilch, he had remained ever so slightly off. So, essentially, he's been out of work since June. I was keeping him on pasture because I did not want to put a 4 year old on stall rest if I could avoid it. I was about to bring him back into work, but then his pasture mate left suddenly in early July, (financial issues apparently forced a re-home - the horse went to a friend of the owner), but, I was not told this was happening, and therefore wasn't around to supervise his turnout, and no one else supervised either. So, long story short, he re-injured himself. I finally pulled the trigger on stall rest at the beginning of August and he was sound as of Aug 22- but work got in the way, so I haven't started bringing him back yet.

So, the goal for Sept/Oct for him is to get him slowly back into work. I expect this week to start the hand walking - and I figure, there's no rush, a little more time off never hurt anything. I'm essentially treating this as a soft tissue injury even though rads and ultrasounds have continued to be clear. It's perplexing, and heartbreaking that we've lost an entire summer, but rushing recovery will serve no one. The biggest worry that I have right now is his weight. He's ballooned despite getting a handful of grain and a very, very, very slow feed hay bag. So, while there is no rush to get him back in work, there is a rush to get him working so that the weight can come off. I've never had an air fern before, so this is actually more disconcerting than the injury/recovery. So, if anyone has any ideas to help with the weight, let me know - the vet knows and we've been keeping an eye on it, but short of starving him, she's had no real advice. There are meds, but those are for horses with thyroid issues, and he has none.

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby DJR » Mon Sep 04, 2017 3:45 pm

I haven't posted to these training threads in quite awhile, so thought I'd start again.

I had a year of medical issues that set me back: right hand surgery (trigger finger) in February which took about 4-6 wks to get enough mobility back to ride seriously again; my severe SI injury in May after falling off our Fjord-x large pony; and in mid-July (in the peak of show season!) I broke my left ring finger. The finger is still in a splint but I'm allowed to take it out for range-of-motion exercises as of last week, and only very light duty. The specialist said that it's at risk for re-fracture until another 4-6 weeks have passed so I have to splint it to ride. That means I ride with the reins around my middle finger. At first it was really odd to ride that way (and it hurt), but now I'm getting used to it and the finger is healed enough that it's quite comfortable.

Anyway, I did as much training and showing as I could despite my medical woes.

My just-turned 6-yr-old, Panache (Argentinian WB-x) debuted at First Level this year. He's the gangly long-yearling I got for a pittance back in 2012, and he's turned into a beautiful horse inside and out. I started riding again four weeks after my finger fracture, and I chose him to ride because he's so steady, reliable, and light to the aids. I had shown him about three times before breaking my finger and he did really well with scores mostly in the 70s and a few in the mid- to high-60s. Next weekend he is entered in the CADORA (Cdn Dressage Owners & Riders Association) provincial championships for First Level, and then most of our dressage shows are done for the year. He's schooling Second Level movements and making a lot of progress, so I intend to continue that work in the next two months. His trot is coming along so well: he used to be a bit stilted/choppy but now is swinging through his back and it's showing in his lengthened strides (towards medium) and in his "sittability". There is still work to be done on his trot and canter, but I'm very excited about what lies ahead with Pan.
2017Aug12 Pan_JennDerksen.jpg
Panache, canter work.
2017Aug12 Pan_JennDerksen.jpg (161.46 KiB) Viewed 646 times


Then there's Jet, my 12-yr-old Friesian/Perch goliath. My off & on summer has been hard on him because it's so hard to keep him in shape if I'm not riding regularly. He's schooling Third and Fourth level movements, and EUREKA we are now getting more clean changes than not (and some rides, they are ALL clean!!!). I wondered if we'd ever be able to say that ... it's taken 3 yrs of work to get from ZERO changing behind to clean changes. So, to the extent I can keep re-conditioning him and keep him happy & sound, I HOPE to debut in the show ring at Third next year (and maybe ... MAYBE ... at a late fall show in October ... ???). So, the next two months will consist of fitness work, lateral work, and keeping him forward/connected on downward transitions. We're also doing more work on half-steps which seems to help his flying changes.
2017Jun JetDeanna_Daphne.jpg
Jet, travers.
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Last but not least is Finn, my 3-yr-old Hano-Shire gelding. I had high hopes to be sitting on him by now, but my medical woes have prevented me from working with him consistently enough to allow that to happen. He LOVES to spend time on his hind legs when playing out in the field with Panache, and that was showing up in his early ground work on the longe line. He doesn't even realize he's being "bad", he's just being his usual dorky horse self. I'm instilling an attitude in him of "forward, not up" with good progress being made before I had to stop due to my finger. I won't be restarting him on the lunge or long-lines until I have more normal grip strength in my left hand, but I hope that happens in about a month. I'd ideally like to have the first few rides on him in place before putting him away for the winter. He's got a SUPER brain, and his movement is quite lovely, so I'm eager to see what the future holds for him.
2017Jun FinnLunge.jpg
Finn, work on the longe line.
2017Jun FinnLunge.jpg (145.03 KiB) Viewed 646 times


That's my crew & plans!
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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby demi » Mon Sep 04, 2017 7:09 pm

DJR, glad you're in! Your horses look great.
Flight, you'll be fit in no time, I just know!
Dresseur, I missed your posts but just figured you were absorbed in your riding. I certainly would be if I was doing the riding that you are doing!! Good luck with Miro and keep us posted on your work with Gala.
Kyra, good luck to you, too. I don't have any injury/problems right now, but I am sure feeling my age. I need to go over to the old folks forum and post about it!!

Image

Rocky after our work today. She looks like she's ready to run barrels!! She was very energetic but she behaved herself and let me work on myself. Just 30 minutes total. 10 minutes of walk and then 20 minutes of steady shortened trot. 20 minutes of trot is all I can handle right now and she was ready to quit, too. Holding herself off her forehand in that short, active trot takes a lot of effort for her. I am so happy with how cooperative she is being about it.

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby piedmontfields » Mon Sep 04, 2017 9:42 pm

Of course I'm in! (very grateful to have the indomitable Emi as my partner in this effort). Love that Deanna is back and Susan is plotting (hoping for the best!). Great to see Rocky!

Main goals:

-Just work on the damn changes. Don't avoid them. Be calm and do a few each session, no matter what.
-Continue to mix in straight-up hill work as a nice break from schooling (and a quick way to work outside the arena as the days get shorter).
-Keep doing the big trot work. It is bigger than a year ago and it is not done.
-Help someone else ride my weird horse! I am out of town quite a bit during this period, so I will be enlisting the talents of a working student at my barn. She is very good with a range of horses, but I know this is one will expand that range a little :lol:

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby Tsavo » Mon Sep 04, 2017 11:07 pm

Dresseur wrote:So, the goal for Sept/Oct for him is to get him slowly back into work. I expect this week to start the hand walking - and I figure, there's no rush, a little more time off never hurt anything. I'm essentially treating this as a soft tissue injury even though rads and ultrasounds have continued to be clear. It's perplexing, and heartbreaking that we've lost an entire summer, but rushing recovery will serve no one. The biggest worry that I have right now is his weight. He's ballooned despite getting a handful of grain and a very, very, very slow feed hay bag. So, while there is no rush to get him back in work, there is a rush to get him working so that the weight can come off. I've never had an air fern before, so this is actually more disconcerting than the injury/recovery. So, if anyone has any ideas to help with the weight, let me know - the vet knows and we've been keeping an eye on it, but short of starving him, she's had no real advice. There are meds, but those are for horses with thyroid issues, and he has none.


Sorry to hear this. Did anything change besides taking him out of work? I have a theory that my horse gained weight in potential response to a vitamin deficiency. I think this may have triggered over-consumption of grass which is the culprit in the weight gain. My vet thinks it was just getting older that did it.

The most successful way I have dieted my horse is with dry lot. Works every time though I try not to witness it.

I loaned another boarder my muzzle which I don't use because I am not that strong. Her horse dropped about 150 pounds and looks to be at perfect weight. So muzzling absolutely works.

Other things that also work though not to that extent are L-thyroxine (Thyro-L). My horse has normal thyroid function but L-thyroxine has been shown to work even in normal horses. There is at least one paper showing that but I haven't investigated this issue lately and am relieved to be off the Thyro-L merry-go-round with FDA constantly closing the lab and worrying about the supply. You have to watch the supply and be prepared (plan) to ramp down if you can't get it. No cold turkey allowed. I will not go back on it because of the supply issue.

My horse has been out of work for about three weeks. He has a slight lameness on the LF only when going right. So that seemed like soft tissue but he came sound when we blocked out the foot. It seems like after pulling the hind shoes that his fronts slowly started going to pot. The LF was progressively getting an underrun heel and the club was getting higher. The fronts were stable for years prior to pulling the hinds. It's like he was unweighting the hinds in the transition to barefoot and toasting the fronts. Yet he moved the same without shoes, took weight behind, etc. so I am not sure this hypothesis is correct.

We pulled the front shoes for at least one cycle to grow the heel and the farrier found a hole in the heel like an old abscess or something. That might explain why he was only lame on the LF going right. He also said that heel was being crushed and had a corn. So I have been walking him around on soft ground. I lunge him at walk in the arena. I keep him off pebbles and hard ground. I might get boots but they would have to be to different sizes I think.

It is interesting that he has not gained more weight during this rest. I have long claimed exercise does not move the needle on this horse in either direction. Some horses have been documented to be exercise refractory. It seems like the only variable that matters is the amount of grass he consumes.

I have also been treating for a pinpoint eye ulcer which I think is completely healed now. I had zero issues getting the meds in. I can do anything to the eye if enough treats are involved. Makes me wonder just how far my horse will go for a treat. Maybe I don't want to know. LOL.

Good luck with your horse.
Last edited by Tsavo on Tue Sep 05, 2017 12:37 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby DJR » Tue Sep 05, 2017 12:59 am

I second the dry lot for helping improving weight in air-fern horses. My Friesian/Perch, Jet, is always kept in a dry lot, and so are my daughter's ponies. It just works better. I'll occasionally given them an hour or two in the alley between pastures to graze on the short grass there, but it's a treat not a regular occurrence. I also feed both Jet and the ponies feeds suitable for IR horses, and they only get a bit. But, without regular work, Jet still gets cresty so I have to be careful with him. It's hard with these easy-keepers!
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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby Rosie B » Tue Sep 05, 2017 1:00 am

This might be a rough challenge for me. I am going back to work on Sept 18th after having been on maternity leave for the past year. I have a clinic this weekend and another one in mid October.

I feel like we made fairly significant progress over the past 2 months. Bliss feels so much more secure and solid in the connection, and much more available and adjustable everywhere in his body. He's also starting to develop some real collection. I'm still schooling mostly basics and asking for a few movements here or there in each ride as a test.

My goals last time specifically were to improve the shoulder ins and the walk/canter/walk transitions. We made good gains there, but still aren't ready to show 2nd level.

So my goals are:
- ride at least 3x a week
- consolidate the gains in the connection and develop Bliss's fitness and stamina for the collected work.
- continue to improve the SI
- start incorporating travers, tenders, and HP into the mix
- school walk pirouettes at least once a week
- continue to challenge his suppleness with lots of serpentines and change of bend
- RIDE every single corner. Every ride.

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby mari » Tue Sep 05, 2017 4:29 am

piedmontfields wrote:-Just work on the damn changes. Don't avoid them. Be calm and do a few each session, no matter what.


Also the damn changes for me... :lol:
The aim of argument or of discussion should not be victory, but progress. ~ Joseph Joubert

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby kande50 » Tue Sep 05, 2017 10:34 am

Tsavo wrote:It is interesting that he has not gained more weight during this rest. I have long claimed exercise does not move the needle on this horse in either direction. Some horses have been documented to be exercise refractory. It seems like the only variable that matters is the amount of grass he consumes.


As with humans and dogs, it takes a lot of exercise to burn enough calories to get any appreciable weight loss, and with horses anyway, that amount of exercise may put them at a higher risk for lameness, depending on how it's done. And then there's the problem that the more I exercise my horses the more time they spend foraging for food, so unless I control the number of calories they're taking in then more exercise doesn't seem to help much.

Right now I"m struggling with my Halflinger mule, who I think looks a lot fatter than he is because he's chunky to start with, and has developed a big belly as he's aged. So I've got his weight down this summer by limiting both pasture and hay, but waffle when it comes time to feed him because I worry I'm not giving him enough at night when I don't go out and throw him handfuls of hay every couple of hours.

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby kande50 » Tue Sep 05, 2017 10:42 am

demi wrote:
Rocky after our work today. She looks like she's ready to run barrels!!.


Looks like you leave the halter on under the bridle, too. I take the cavessons off my bridles and leave the halters on because I like to be able to tie them when I need to without having to go find a halter.

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby Tsavo » Tue Sep 05, 2017 11:48 am

kande50 wrote:
Tsavo wrote:It is interesting that he has not gained more weight during this rest. I have long claimed exercise does not move the needle on this horse in either direction. Some horses have been documented to be exercise refractory. It seems like the only variable that matters is the amount of grass he consumes.


As with humans and dogs, it takes a lot of exercise to burn enough calories to get any appreciable weight loss, and with horses anyway, that amount of exercise may put them at a higher risk for lameness, depending on how it's done. And then there's the problem that the more I exercise my horses the more time they spend foraging for food, so unless I control the number of calories they're taking in then more exercise doesn't seem to help much.


Yes that's true but I think that article showed that it is even worse. That the more exercise those horses got, the more thrifty they got because their metabolism downshifted in response. Exercise is counterproductive in those horses to lose weight because it is making the metabolic rate issue worse.
Last edited by Tsavo on Tue Sep 05, 2017 1:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby Ryeissa » Tue Sep 05, 2017 12:02 pm

I've been able to up my # rides per month more towards 18, so that helps a lot! Revising assorted ideas around canter- canter walk, walk canter, and he feels so much more ready this month to do that work again. I had stayed away from that work till I felt it could be done with more ease/relaxation. My horse loves to canter so he can get going a bit, the HH at the trot have really helped the canter

Have a (low key) show soon, not sure what level I will do.

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby Dresseur » Tue Sep 05, 2017 12:48 pm

For Miro, he's on stall rest, so other than getting out for a few minutes to get some grass and relieve boredom, he's not grazing. However, I've already purchased a muzzle for him for when he does go back out. Tsavo, this has presented similarly to your situation, slightly, slightly off on the left fore while circling right. There was never any catastrophic lameness - just a particularly hard play session where he slid and fell down. He's barefoot, and the farrier is excellent - he's not spotted any bruising or other signs there. There has been no heat, no swelling, no digital pulse. Xrays of the hoof and leg revealed nothing, and ultrasound revealed nothing. So, I assume that he tweaked something. At the moment he's getting a handful of healthy edge and 2 flakes of hay in the am, one in the afternoon and 2 flakes pm - but he has an ultra slow feeder with 1" holes, so it lasts. Although, my barn manager says that he could get hay through a hairnet. Sigh.

In any case. I videoed him yesterday. He was sound 2 weeks ago, yesterday I thought that I saw something - but it's virtually impossible to tell if it's un-evenness because he's screwing around or if there is unsoundness. So, my heart broke again. We are going to start short walking bursts and see what happens. I just don't understand how he could be sound on stall rest, stay on stall rest, and then seem as if he's unsound again. Sigh. Horses.

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby Ponichiwa » Tue Sep 05, 2017 1:07 pm

Man. Am I ever glad July and August are over. It's been a heck of a stress the last 8 weeks. Dresseur and Tsavo, sorry to hear about the lameness struggles. Best of luck with their resolution!

My goals are different than they would have been had we not been hit with a hurricane. Kiwi and I have lost quite a bit of fitness in the nearly 2 weeks of off time we've had, so here's our new set:
- Ride 4x/week
- (Fitness allowing) Spend some real time in the canter to make it feel a bit less fragile. Went to a schooling show near the end of August at 3rd and ended up with flying changes everywhere thanks to a bit of tension due to environment and not being able to settle it down in the canter. Flying. Changes. Everywhere. So the new plan is to canter around and change things (like bend, stride length, etc.) and keep the lead I started on unless expressly desired to change.
- Me: 20 squats while brushing teeth. 15k steps/day. Choose more salads.

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby Tsavo » Tue Sep 05, 2017 1:26 pm

Wow I hope we continue to connect about these very similar lamenesses and share insights. But I want to tell you to hang in there. Did you do any blocking? We blocked and it was my horse's foot. Foot is almost always the culprit. This happened once before when my horse was only lame when the bum leg was on the outside. We never figured it out but surmised a stone bruise. It resolved. But you have not found any bruising.

I am floored that your horse is blowing up when not being grazed. I just don't know what to say. I think grass is pretty clearly the culprit with my horse and others horses at this barn. And the two metabolic horses who are not on grass are on the thin side.

I agree it is very hard to tell in some of these cases. Many days I had to send my horse around many times before I decided yes he is gimping. Had I only done it a few times I might have concluded he was not. It was intermittent at times. He was sound going left and going straight. I rested and him and then started lunging him every day. After about a week I called the vet because it wasn't resolving with rest.

If rads and sonogram reveal nothing that isn't that pretty good evidence it is something in the foot that will grow out?

The fact that your horse's lameness seemed to flare on rest after coming sound may suggest it is a slow brewing abscess, no? Blocking the foot out to see if he comes sound may ease your mind that it is foot and not soft tissue. It also could be zooing around and tweaking an injury like you suggest but unless you know he is zooing around in the stall, I don't think that is the explanation.

Again, hang in there.

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby Dresseur » Tue Sep 05, 2017 1:53 pm

Tsavo, we blocked in the initial vet visit - he was blocked to about 98% soundness in the fetlock, so it's definitely something down low. Maybe at this point there is an abscess brewing. We had done rads of the hoof to look for a track initially, but none showed. And of course, I'm terrified about founder given his weight now.

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby Tsavo » Tue Sep 05, 2017 2:02 pm

I still don't get how your how is gaining weight. Is he retaining fluids?

I have asked my barn to find the worst quality hay that isn't moldy for my horse. They didn't do it but I think it is a good idea. Make sure you are feeding balancer as you cut back. Balancer assumes grass which your horse is not getting so I would consider upping the amount of it.

Is it possible it is a compensatory lameness? That is, is he gimping on that to protect another leg? Did any other lameness present when the LF was blocked out?

I think you need a Lameness Locator(TM)!!!!!!!!

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby demi » Tue Sep 05, 2017 2:35 pm

Dresseur wrote:For Miro, he's on stall rest, so other than getting out for a few minutes to get some grass and relieve boredom, he's not grazing. ...... At the moment he's getting a handful of healthy edge and 2 flakes of hay in the am, one in the afternoon and 2 flakes pm -......

.....In any case. I videoed him yesterday. He was sound 2 weeks ago, yesterday I thought that I saw something - but it's virtually impossible to tell if it's un-evenness because he's screwing around or if there is unsoundness. So, my heart broke again. We are going to start short walking bursts and see what happens. I just don't understand how he could be sound on stall rest, stay on stall rest, and then seem as if he's unsound again. Sigh. Horses.


I feel for you! but am just thinking a few things:

5 flakes of hay a day might be a lot, especially depending on the kind. Even the grass hay, coastal bermuda, which we feed in Texas, could easily amount to 3-5 lbs per flake. That would be 15-25 lbs of hay per day if he gets 5 flakes. About how much does he weigh? Some horses only need 1% of their body weight in hay (or even in total feed, i.e. hay plus concentrated feed). If he only weighs 1000lbs, that would be only 10 lbs of hay. It doesn't seem like much and my easy keeper, Rocky complains bitterly over the seemingly scant amount I feed her.(see her pic a few posts back for reference..and she is on the heavy side ATM because of too much grazing).

I worry about founder with my easy keepers, too, so I weigh Rocky's hay every day. And when we have a lot of grass, she doesnt get any hay, plus I control carefully (obsessively!) how much grazing time she gets.

The other thing I was thinking is that he may have looked lame when you lounged him yesterday because he is not used to total stall rest and is a bit stiff or otherwise kinked up. Plus, you are emotional about it now and your "eye" may be making it look worse than it really is.

Don't worry too much because you are doing more than enough to get to the bottom of this.

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby Dresseur » Tue Sep 05, 2017 2:36 pm

No other lameness presented itself - it's definitely that leg. I think down low, and the only thing that we didn't do was haul him out to get an MRI done.
His weight is not fluid weight, he's just fat. I had found out that they were feeding him a bale and a half which started the massive weight gain, but now I'm playing catch up. So, there's that, but at this point, he should have started losing. I don't have him on a balancer... that I will look into.

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby Sue B » Tue Sep 05, 2017 4:05 pm

Jingles for all who have or had lame horses or are lame themselves.

Deanna your horses look wonderful--you make me feel like a slacker. ;)



Dresseuer, my Tio is an air fern and had mysterious front foot issues his 4th and a little into his 5th year. Seemed to coincide with his metabolic shift to air fernness but the thing that helped most was shoeing the fronts with just plane plates. His soles during that time period seemed thin and soft so who knows. He is on pasture 24/7 btw and wears a muzzle soon as the spring grass appears and last year wore it until it snowed. This year, as a newly minted 6 year old, he only wore the muzzle this spring and will probably wear it this fall for a month or so when he rotates into the alfalfa pasture. This year though he has had no lameness issues or short-stridedness nor has his weight gotten scary. Also, this year his feet are in fantastic shape, the best they have ever been! He is fat, but before, he was putting on fat lumps just ahead of his shoulders, over his butt and approaching his crest and this year he isn't doing that. People have strongly suggested dry-lotting him in the past, but I have 12 acres of hilly pasture that he and Rudy gallop all over so they do maintain a level of fitness even when I can't ride. So I have no answers for you but I can say that Tio gets along very well with his muzzle and it did help a bunch.

I managed to ride several days so far in spite of another vicious migraine and the unrelenting heat. I even got ds to do a little video of each horse which I will share once I get it uploaded and edited. Tio, I think, looks really good training wise although that day he chose to canter with his head straight in the air--not enough warm-up before cantering I'm sure. I had to rush because I was running out of ability to stay up on the horse. Oh well. Anyways, I still plan on getting flying changes put on Rudy and I think I'll bring Tio along for the ride. I am hoping to also accompany my friend to her jumping lessons whenever I can. Right now I am building jump standards so I can do some cross rails in addition to my cavelletti.

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby khall » Tue Sep 05, 2017 4:27 pm

I'm in for this time, hoping for cooler weather and keeping an eye on Irma. I have some open stalls so will offer them to evacuees needing equine housing from FL.

Rip's last scope was excellent, even better than the previous. So we are on the right track with him. Still using throat spray 3 times a week but we don't have to go back for another scope for 2 months! Yeah!!! Have lunged and worked in hand some. HIs in hand work is awesome. Good on the lunge too. Trying to get his sister Gaila going too (she is FAT) and I am considering selling her. She keeps getting put on the back burner and I really do not need more than 2 riding horses, my filly and Rip. She would be a beautiful WD horse, with easy trot to sit and big round girl that she is.

My plans are: Ride as much as I can these next 2 months. Looking at road trip with my friend who went to Spain with me to visit our other friend who went with us and lives in Aiken. We want to try Pierre Cousyn out as someone to lesson with. http://www.cousyndressage.com
Now that Rip is good health wise and the weather will hopefully be cooling off. We also have a clinic coming up with Jillian Kreinbring in November. Thought about doing a schooling show but decided we would rather try some lessons instead. I really want to put changes on Rip and work more on piaffe/half steps.

I need to get my filly back out and do some work with her before winter.

Yeah Moutaineer!! Glad Laddie is back US.
SF, sorry to hear Annabelle keeps injuring herself. That is no fun!
Dresseur ugh on Miro. Hope he comes sound and stays that way. As for weight management: soak hay (every single horse on my farm gets soaked hay only), slow feeder hay nets (though I just feed small meals 4-5 times a day), I use just a vitamin and mineral supplement (Platiunum and mega cell, I would use one of the smartpak ones but my horses won't eat them) I do not use a balancer ration except on my 22 yr old who needs the extra protein, grazing muzzles and working the horse, I've tried Thyro L with no luck. My older mare is on prascend and has no weight issues now, but had a bad founder in 2015 so still feed her carefully.

Let's hope for cooler weather, not a big hit from Irma and lots of riding now fall is here!

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby Kyra's Mom » Tue Sep 05, 2017 8:00 pm

Ok...I finally get a day when I can work my horse and we have abysmal air quality...RED...unhealthy. Poor horse have to live in it 24/7 so I certainly don't want to work her in this yuck.

I can't even see the mountains. Idaho has some fires but areas of Oregon, Washington, BC and Montana are burning up with some massive and hot fires. Due to the weather patterns, it just sucks the smoke right into our valley. Oh if we could somehow take some of that Harvey water and bring it up here.

Horse and I had a spa day instead. Her tail was gross from neglect and almost on the ground. So a nice shampoo, condition and bang job :D .

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby Sue B » Tue Sep 05, 2017 10:25 pm

So yeah, Susan, I was planning on riding this evening, but coach just cancelled soccer practice due to the smoke. If it doesn't improve, they may cancel the game tomorrow as well so it must even be bad up in the Wood River Valley! Tio was coughing on Sunday, maybe I shouldn't ride him until the smoke clears a bit. Idaho Falls, btw, was horrible yesterday too.

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby StraightForward » Wed Sep 06, 2017 1:55 pm

This article on smoke and horses came across my Facebook feed this morning: http://www.vetmed.ucdavis.edu/ceh/local ... esmoke.pdf

Annabelle is more willing to trot a bit on the lunge, but still looks to be several days out from riding. Between the Oregon and Montana fires though, the smoke might keep us from doing more than in-hand walk work for a couple more weeks though. Yesterday we practiced some flexions and a bit of shoulder in. It's hard to use the arena wall as an aid though, because they let bindweed grow up through the wire this summer before addressing the weeds, and she focuses her attention on trying to grab at dried bits that are left in the fence.
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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby Ryeissa » Wed Sep 06, 2017 2:02 pm

even in the midwest we had cloudy air and quality warnings.

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby Kyra's Mom » Wed Sep 06, 2017 3:52 pm

Wow...allow 4-6 weeks AFTER the air clears to let them clear the gunk out of their lungs. Luckily, Kyra is so totally out of shape that walking is the first step in legging her back up.
Speaking of clearing up...looks worse than ever this morning :shock: .

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby Moutaineer » Wed Sep 06, 2017 5:42 pm

The air is beyond revolting here in the Salt Lake Valley (which is often nasty at this time of year anyway due to our lovely smog inversions but the smoke on top really takes the cake,) and not a whole lot better up in the mountains.

A friend had to do an emergency evacuation with 6 horses and 8 dogs yesterday morning. The fire took out her turnout pens but was kept away from the house and barn, thankfully.

A small chance of rain Friday and Saturday. Keep your fingers crossed...

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby Rosie B » Wed Sep 06, 2017 6:30 pm

Fingers crossed for all you guys with poor air quality and fires to contend with. As I write this it is pouring down buckets, and the noise on my tin roof is deafening. Hoping some of this rain finds its way to where it's needed.

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby piedmontfields » Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:29 am

Air quality and hurricanes are our collective reality in dressage training. Pretty humbling.

I feel spoiled in that eastern Tennessee it has been especially beautiful and good for outdoor riding of late. It reminds me of the low humidity, low summer temp days of my youth and college years in upstate New York. Emi and I are grateful for the kind weather....and we are not that far from switching from night turnout to day turnout (which is a real change on her exercise needs/attitudes: aka 15 hours turnout vs 8).

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby Mareless » Thu Sep 07, 2017 2:15 am

I'm going to try to join in on this 'challenge'. I haven't been good at all about posting this summer, but things are going well with the horse I'm leasing.

For September and October I really want to focus on improving the trot. Or, should I say, I want to be able to ride all his trots! When I first started leasing him this summer, I could barely get him into a trot, and I couldn't sustain it at all. Now we do trot transitions easily, and are playing with medium trot, stretchy trot and even a little extension now and then, but our trot sessions only go about 5 minutes at a time before I'm whupped. That's when we take a walk break and do some lateral work while I catch my breath. He is a big lug to get moving and to stay in rhythm with. That said, I do love his trot, it has so much suspension, probably the most I've ever experienced (and so, working on sitting trot without me running out of steam. Core strength!).

Another thing I'd really like is to find someone willing to take pictures and maybe a short video of us on a monthly basis. I really wish I'd gotten some back in June when I first started riding him, because he's a different horse now and I'm definitely a different rider. It would be nice to document our progress.

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby Moutaineer » Thu Sep 07, 2017 3:50 am

Careless, I'm planning to document Laddies rehab with monthly pictures. I think it might help me realize that we are making progress over the winter. Sometimes it's hard to tell when you see them every day.

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby Sue B » Thu Sep 07, 2017 2:21 pm

Okay, I think I have a link to video of Tio. I am quite pleased with his progress. You will see no more pokey walk, although canter was not as good as usual. Bear in mind that I stopped because I was afraid I was going to collapse from the severe migraine I was dealing with.

https://plus.google.com/115486105498206029133/posts/AtbzvTkq1gd

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby piedmontfields » Thu Sep 07, 2017 4:57 pm

Tio is a tank! I mean that in an admiring the brick house kind of way. Sue, is what's in this clip fairly "normal" for him? (degree and kinds of evasions or resistances in between decent work)

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby Sue B » Thu Sep 07, 2017 9:42 pm

Yup, this is fairly normal IF you factor in my not lunging him prior to hopping on. Normally, I lunge him 10-15 minutes and then ride about 20-25 minutes, but that day it was all I could do to climb on and ride a bit. That clip is my entire ride minus about 2 minutes of walk. That's why I'm pleased with him. ;) That head in the air canter is what he used to do, like last Spring, now with a proper warm-up he canters like he did at the end.

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby khall » Thu Sep 07, 2017 9:50 pm

DJR glad your injuries are healing, rough summer there! All your ponies are looking fabulous, your diamond in the rough especially:) and good grief how big is your 3 yr old?

Tio looks like my horses! Short coupled and round. I would like to see more length of stride there. Can he be naughty? Is that why you ride him short and up? If so I can relate! Still would like to see longer neck and longer stride.

Gosh I had a good workout with Rip today! Just did some light lunging and then in hand and wow nice! Some really good half steps to piaffe steps (moving forward) what I like is that I can collect the walk and then activate that into the piaffe quite easily. He is doing this mostly off of voice/clucking with just touches of the whip. He is really lifting up from the base of the neck in the collected walk and so light in the hand. He easily comes to a collected halt from piaffe and then can RB with very light aids. You have no idea how happy this makes me! My big lug of a horse whose go to for so long was to throw himself into his chest and wallow on the bit is now a light as feather active and collected steed!!! Patience and persistence has paid off:)

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby Sue B » Thu Sep 07, 2017 10:47 pm

Khall, The shorter rein and more up is what he finds easier and more comfortable. His stride is gradually getting longer as he develops carrying strength and the rein length is the one I found he feels most secure at. If there is any loss of contact, he gets flippy and fussy in his head, so again, it will be a matter of time, strength and balance until he can stretch out more. He is not a horse who tolerates being on the forehand and will take off bucking if he feels insecure in his balance whether under saddle or on the lunge. A year ago, he did not overstep even in the walk and was no where close in the trot so, again, I am really pleased with his progress under saddle. Also, a year ago he would/could not canter with me on him except the stride or two between cavelletti. He will never be a fancy dressage horse, but he doesn't have to be, cuz I plan on doing low level eventing type stuff on him. In case you can't tell on the vid, he loves anything to do with jumping and gymnastics.

Btw, he may be a tank, but he is actually very light in the bit and off the ground, 99% of the time. The other 1% of the time he can make that neck solid and straight as a board and just go off where he pleases. He can also completely ignore any and all requests to move, bend, you name it, which can be disconcerting, to say the least. I have learned to be quietly persistent until he acquiesces--over time he has come to realize that there's no point in arguing, because I am not going to give in or go away. I really am looking forward to venturing out to event derbies next year.

ETA: Sorry you guys don't share my excitement. I guess you had to be there. :P

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby Moutaineer » Thu Sep 07, 2017 10:51 pm

Doing that beastly work thing, will look later, Sue B!

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby piedmontfields » Fri Sep 08, 2017 12:02 am

Sue B wrote: ETA: Sorry you guys don't share my excitement. I guess you had to be there. :P


Sue, that is totally why I asked about what is normal. Given what you usually do vs this day, I'd declare a success, too! :D I like how handy Tio looks.

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby demi » Fri Sep 08, 2017 5:06 am

Mareless, glad your're in this time. I like that you want to take pics, and Mountaineer, too. I think pics and vids add so much to the discussion, not only for those reading, but for the posters themselves. I know not all of us are in a position to get pics/vids taken and I understand because I have that problem myself. HOWEVER! I know the soloshot3 is getting closer to a reality and I will cerrtainly post vids once I get it...I may have a small problem figuring out how to use it :roll: but I'll worry about that when the time comes.

SueB, thanks so much for your video. I appreciate your posts and will now have a much better idea of what you're up to. I know that you started Tio yourself and have done all the work, and he is still relatively young (5 or 6ish?). Some of the bigger ones can take longer to mature and that figures largely into the equation. I suspect Tio will come into his own one day soon and look forward to more videos. Thanks again for posting.

Rocky is surprising me with her cooperative and balanced work. When I stopped trying to do dressage with her almost 2 yrs ago, It seemed like in order to keep her off her forehand I had to do a half halt every other stride. No exaggeration.I found it very frustrating. Now, though, she is staying balanced on her own. Could the difference be that I have been using the "steady shortened trot" for the major part of each ride? The last couple of rides I have experimented with lengthening out the trot just for a couple of strides and she responded nicely.

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby Dresseur » Fri Sep 08, 2017 1:25 pm

So, words cannot express how angry I am right now. If you all remember how I said that I didn't understand how Miro was sound and then 2 weeks later was back to being uneven ON STALL REST, well, I found out how.

Apparently, my barn manager felt badly for him and decided that she would have her BOYFRIEND take him for WALKS AROUND THE INDOOR ARENA. I don't know how long this has been going on, but I found out about it on Wednesday when I innocently asked what Miro had gotten himself into today (he's been pulling things into his stall and pushing against his stall door, which is forcing poop into the aisle through the stall door grate. She tells me, "Oh, well, he decided to be big man on campus today for his walk and he was bucking and rearing."

Cue my head absolutely exploding. I reamed her out, then called the barn owner down and explained the situation and gave notice.
Then I called Andrea and cried hysterically.

I don't understand. Stall rest is STALL REST. Who does that!?! This has set me back weeks in rehab and it's not fair to him.

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby piedmontfields » Fri Sep 08, 2017 1:37 pm

ARGH!!! (at least you found out what was happening)

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby Tsavo » Fri Sep 08, 2017 1:52 pm

Speechless. Don't despair, Dresseur. You have the explanation. Press ahead.

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby kande50 » Fri Sep 08, 2017 1:52 pm

Sue B wrote:
ETA: Sorry you guys don't share my excitement. I guess you had to be there. :P


I think that's absolutely true, Sue B. Unless someone has struggled through the struggles they have no clue what those struggles were, except for those who are in about the place, and they get it.

It's like when we were younger and we couldn't understand why everyone didn't just get on their young horses and ride them instead of doing all that lungeing and ground work first. :-)

He's coming, and now that you've pointed out how he was vs how he is now, I can see what you've been working on.

Posting video is tricky sometimes, because it's often so hard to tell which part of the video observers have in mind when they comment.
Last edited by kande50 on Fri Sep 08, 2017 1:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby Ryeissa » Fri Sep 08, 2017 1:53 pm

I had that happen too, Dresseur, to my horse. Absolutely unexcusable! I am so sorry!

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Re: September and October Goals and Progress

Postby kande50 » Fri Sep 08, 2017 1:57 pm

Ryeissa wrote:I had that happen too, Dresseur, to my horse. Absolutely unexcusable! I am so sorry!


I can understand how a horse might accidentally get turned out, but to deliberately take a horse out and exercise him when someone knows he's on stall rest is unbelievable. What kind of barn manager either doesn't know what stall rest is, or thinks she knows more than the owner and the vet?


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