Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

A forum for discussion of training in dressage
demi
Bringing Life to the DDBB
Posts: 1360
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2015 7:02 pm
Location: Texas

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby demi » Tue Aug 21, 2018 9:42 pm

I don’t know if she has school horses. It’s been at least 28 years since I last saw her!! But maybe she could be talked into giving lessons on one of her horses, if she had one that was suitable.

I boarded with them before Carolyn even got into dressage. She had a little QH stallion named Buzzy Bars. While I was still there she got a TB and shortly after I moved she started training with Hilda. The rest is history!

piedmontfields
Bringing Life to the DDBB
Posts: 1728
Joined: Mon Oct 19, 2015 4:41 pm
Location: E Tennessee USA

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby piedmontfields » Tue Aug 21, 2018 11:14 pm

Oh, I'm bummed, Demi, but so glad you caught it early and recovery time is not that bad. We had an eventer at my barn with a similar diagnosis and he had to be on more stall rest (with a little attached paddock) due to his penchant for airs above the ground. But he recovered well and is back in work in about 2 months time.

Tsavo
Bringing Life to the DDBB
Posts: 1431
Joined: Wed May 25, 2016 2:01 am

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby Tsavo » Tue Aug 21, 2018 11:59 pm

Demi sorry to hear that. Do you think she caused the small tear when she took the chunk out of her foot? How did she do that? Is it on the inside?

User avatar
Rosie B
500 post plus club
Posts: 560
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2015 11:38 pm

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby Rosie B » Wed Aug 22, 2018 12:42 am

Demi - sorry about your luck. That's tough.

Hot4spots - I would try the closer place.

I'm pleased to report that I am back in the saddle!! Pneumonia kept me out of it for 16 days, but I had my first ride back tonight and Bliss felt super. Onward and upward!

Tsavo
Bringing Life to the DDBB
Posts: 1431
Joined: Wed May 25, 2016 2:01 am

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby Tsavo » Wed Aug 22, 2018 12:45 am

That's great, Rosie.

I had mycoplasma pneumonia at my wedding and was hospitalized for 3 days immediately afterward. Luckily we booked the honeymoon for week later although my doctor told me not to go even then and that I would be too wiped out. I went and it was okay but I was still recovering for sure.

User avatar
StraightForward
Bringing Life to the DDBB
Posts: 1336
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2015 3:04 pm

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby StraightForward » Wed Aug 22, 2018 3:49 am

Demi, so sorry to hear that Rocky is injured. Jingles for a quick and speedy recovery!

Khall, exciting to be preparing for your first show in a long time, as well as getting your two girls going!

H4S, hope you find a good place to take lessons.

Rosie, glad you are feeling better and back in the saddle!

I have been riding Susan's Kyra 3-4 times a week for almost a month now, so we've probably done at least a dozen rides. Tonight was the first night she really felt like she was coming together and I could sit her trot. I'm looking forward to taking a lesson on her next Monday.

I'm hoping Annabelle is not going to be added to the injured list. She has been coming out of her stall short on the LH, but works out of it. She had bodywork this morning, and I rode tonight after giving her about 9 days off and she was about the same as before the bodywork. I think I'll try for a few more short rides this week and see how it goes. I was hoping to go to a show in early September, but that might not happen. I think entry closing is the 30th, so I have a few more days to decide.

The new girl, Tesla, is quite a joy. She is reveling in all the attention and is a total love bug. A few days ago I walked her down the irrigation canal bank with rushing water and all, about 1/2 a mile away from the stable and she did great. I'm taking next week off work, so I'll probably start some more formal ground work now that she's had some time to settle in to the new routine.
The UDBB member known as AQHA Hunter

khall
Bringing Life to the DDBB
Posts: 1136
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2015 1:47 am

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby khall » Wed Aug 22, 2018 6:06 pm

Oh yeah for Tesla SF!! She is a pretty girl:) Nice mover too. Jingles for Annabelle that she comes right. Glad you are able to ride Kyra though.

Glad you are back in the saddle again Rosie!

Rip is really dialed in for me these days. Asking the questions and he is quietly and quickly coming up with the answers. I am loving it! Worked on the medium trot today and I really think SI to medium back to SI will be the answer to me sitting easier on Rip during medium trot. One of those exercises that has always been in my head but for whatever reason I had not really visited it with Rip. Just played out in the field with stuff today, will ride him in the arena next time and put him on a circle for this exercise. He is being so much fun to ride!

Gaila per the trainer is now starting to canter US with no issues. Interesting dealing with another trainer, I might make a suggestion or 2 considering what I know of my horse, trainer gets a bit defensive. I am not unhappy at all, but really I do know my horse quite well considering I BRED her, RAISED her and put most of the work on her (Mark rode her some and I had a cowboy put the first 20 rides on her). I put the majority of the work in the mare, really I do know what I am talking about.

Hot4Spots
Herd Member
Posts: 123
Joined: Tue Oct 20, 2015 10:52 pm

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby Hot4Spots » Wed Aug 22, 2018 7:37 pm

demi wrote:I don’t know if she has school horses. It’s been at least 28 years since I last saw her!! But maybe she could be talked into giving lessons on one of her horses, if she had one that was suitable.

I boarded with them before Carolyn even got into dressage. She had a little QH stallion named Buzzy Bars. While I was still there she got a TB and shortly after I moved she started training with Hilda. The rest is history!



Demi, this is surely out of left field, and I am totally aware that Texas is a huge state, but by any chance do you know Linda Pryor of Top Pryority Ponies? She and I go waaaaay back to the '70s when I boarded in Golden Gate Park.

demi
Bringing Life to the DDBB
Posts: 1360
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2015 7:02 pm
Location: Texas

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby demi » Thu Aug 23, 2018 2:12 am

Hot4Spots,I havent heard of your friend but I found her website and she is only about an hour south of me. Looks like she has some nice ponies! Maybe I’ll see her at a show someday.

User avatar
Flight
Bringing Life to the DDBB
Posts: 1107
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2015 11:39 pm
Location: Australia

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby Flight » Thu Aug 23, 2018 8:50 pm

Glad you are back riding Rosie. Being sick is the worst.

I went and watched a clinic with a classical instructor and it was great! She comes down 4x a year so I'm desperately trying to wrangle a riding spot. She did very similar stuff to my old instructor but explained things so clearly and specifically. It was great! I was working nightshift and I quickly dragged Ding out of the paddock for a quick ride before work because I was so excited from some of the stuff I learned :D
I know there is a whole debate about classical vs modern, but I truly think a good classical approach is for me.

Ponichiwa
Herd Member
Posts: 486
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2015 2:27 pm

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby Ponichiwa » Fri Aug 24, 2018 12:32 pm

Demi-- so sorry about Rocky, but at least you caught it early.

DJR-- good for you! Those are great scores for getting back into 3rd.

Flight-- glad you've found an instructor you get along with again. That makes a world of difference.

As for me-- my intentions were to get more into the canter pirouette work this month, but that's been derailed by the headcold from hell (week 3 and I can finally ride without coughing). However, I rode through the 4-3 canter work the other day and it wasn't out of our reach. I imagine the 10m half-circle in counter canter is much tougher on a larger horse, but Kiwi nailed it to both directions. I'm very happy with where she is (except that she's a bit fat after 2.5 weeks of mostly just trail riding at the walk).

My other news is here:
Image

That's right. Queso has now been sat on. Completely uneventfully. I can see how some of the western disciplines look down on dressage people for the amount of prep work that goes into making a young horse rideable; if all the QHs are like Queso, it's overkill.

On that topic, I've been teaching him to longe. It's been a very long time since my last young horse-- 8 years-- and my skills are rusty. Luckily for all parties involved, Queso has been very patient as I sort out relative body positioning and longe line/whip handling.

User avatar
StraightForward
Bringing Life to the DDBB
Posts: 1336
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2015 3:04 pm

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby StraightForward » Fri Aug 24, 2018 3:58 pm

How exciting to be up there on Queso already! Yes, the stock horses can be quite easy, but they still benefit from the same kinds of groundwork prep if they're destined to be dressage horses. When I was 13 or so, my best friend acquired a 3 yo POA mare - we would go out in the pen and slip on her bareback and lead each other around. Then one day we decided to "start" her, so we put on the saddle and bridle, and that seemed OK, I got on, friend got on their sainted pony, we opened the gate and went for a trail ride up the mountain. From then on, she was "broke."

Nasty air quality here from the fires, so I wasn't too inclined to ride last night. However, Tesla ventured into the indoor for the second time (aisleway is narrow, so that was a big step), wore a surcingle, and was bridled for what I think is the first time. I need to get a rubber bit for her though, since she's so tall that it's hard to ensure that her teeth don't get banged as she gets used to the bridling process. She is turning into quite the treat hound though, so I think wrapping the bit in fruit leather will get her accepting it nicely soon enough.

Annabelle was moving much better last night, to my relief. Her new cob-sized serrata arrived from Portugul yesterday, so we did some side-rein free lunging and got much better results with her posture and movement. It's so nice having the proper equipment! She tends to get stiff in her lumbars but last night she was flexing and stepping under nicely. I have also been revisiting Tristan Tucker's in-hand pattern to loosen her back and ribs, and she finds the stepping back and to the right completely impossible. Given that her RH is the one that doesn't want to go under the body and flex, I think it's important to address this to get her more supple. For now, we're backing up IH on circles both directions. Hopefully that will supple the hind leg enough to accomplish the movement, and improve the ridden lateral work as well.
The UDBB member known as AQHA Hunter

Ryeissa
500 post plus club
Posts: 990
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2015 1:41 pm

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby Ryeissa » Fri Aug 24, 2018 4:22 pm

why yes, I do have the cutest jumper! we had a great clinic with gymnastics, now back to dressage for Sept (more or less). Trailered alone just fine, cantered a grid, and handled himself like the champ he is.
Started doing more 1/4 turns in canter to prep for Flying changes, and overall STRAIGHT CANTER work. Curious to see the new USDF tests that are coming out. He is getting really strong, so we have to revisit the HH a lot since he kind of forgets to balance when his hind legs are a 'jumpin.

Sue B
500 post plus club
Posts: 669
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2015 2:55 pm
Location: Spud country (Idaho)

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby Sue B » Fri Aug 24, 2018 4:43 pm

Smoke is bad enough here that they cancelled sports comps and practices yesterday district wide. Right here, particulate matter was in the red zone all day, with visibility less than 2 miles and so, once again, I did not ride. I guess until this air pattern changes, riding will be hit-and-miss since I don't have an indoor and my lungs object to working out in that heavy of smoke. Hoping today will be better--so far I can even see bits of sky! Fingers crossed that will still be the case this evening.

Rye, Riot is adorable.

Moutaineer
Bringing Life to the DDBB
Posts: 1180
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2015 2:45 pm
Location: Utah

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby Moutaineer » Fri Aug 24, 2018 4:53 pm

The air here is quite a bit better here today and the forecast is for it to clear out more over the weekend.

I did manage to ride yesterday, which was good, the rest of the week has been a bust as I had a supposedly simple medical procedure at the start of the week that turned into a horror show and left me largely non-functional for a couple of days...

exvet
Herd Member
Posts: 303
Joined: Tue Oct 20, 2015 12:28 pm
Location: Phoenix

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby exvet » Fri Aug 24, 2018 7:22 pm

Just got back from another lesson and Junior is definitely developing better balance and more strength. As a result he's moving freer with more swing through his back. I got to see ourselves in the mirror on a few occasions and I was like, wow, not so much of a baby cob any more 8-) well, until the grey stallion walked in :lol: . I'm planning on taking Junior to the regionals for schooling at the showgrounds that weekend. We'll see if his level-headed nature holds true through all the craziness that goes on there. If he manages to keep it together, I think I'll enter him in training level at the recognized show in November.

khall
Bringing Life to the DDBB
Posts: 1136
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2015 1:47 am

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby khall » Fri Aug 24, 2018 8:59 pm

exvet way cool for Junior! Is he still intact? Cross my fingers he minds his manners at the show! I had thought about taking my filly when I go to just a schooling show to hang out when I take Rip but then decided better not. At least not this time.

exvet
Herd Member
Posts: 303
Joined: Tue Oct 20, 2015 12:28 pm
Location: Phoenix

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby exvet » Fri Aug 24, 2018 9:16 pm

Junior is a gelding. I wish I had been able to keep him intact; but, at the time I was having to downsize, I felt he would be easier to 'move' if it came to it having already been gelded. Of course now, I regret that decision but I didn't have a crystal ball. At least I don't have to worry about the hormones or who he's standing next to, or where he'll be stabled at the show etc... I have a couple of rides scheduled with Heather Blitz right after that show; so, I have many reasons for wanting him to be comfortable at the show.

User avatar
StraightForward
Bringing Life to the DDBB
Posts: 1336
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2015 3:04 pm

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby StraightForward » Tue Aug 28, 2018 12:14 am

Today was lesson day. I'm not sure if I've ever had two lessons in one day before, but I lived through it.

First thing in the morning was Annabelle. We got some nice trot work, but nothing to write home about. Need more forward and more bend, but overall I as pretty happy, given that it was our second real ride after her being off for about 10 days.

Second lesson was on Kyra. I wish I'd gotten video, because it was the best ride I've ever had on Kyra. Instructor got us working quite nicely and I think I have SI sorted out much better now. We did quite a bit of renver a, a little travers, and canter SI on a square, and got Miss K sitting a bit and just going along really nicely; light and responsive, and more focused on me than usual.

Looking forward to our next lessons in a few weeks!
The UDBB member known as AQHA Hunter

Kyra's Mom
500 post plus club
Posts: 559
Joined: Tue Oct 20, 2015 2:04 am
Location: Sunny? Southern Idaho

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby Kyra's Mom » Tue Aug 28, 2018 6:51 am

StraightForward wrote:Today was lesson day. I'm not sure if I've ever had two lessons in one day before, but I lived through it.


Second lesson was on Kyra. I wish I'd gotten video, because it was the best ride I've ever had on Kyra. Instructor got us working quite nicely and I think I have SI sorted out much better now. We did quite a bit of renver a, a little travers, and canter SI on a square, and got Miss K sitting a bit and just going along really nicely; light and responsive, and more focused on me than usual.

Looking forward to our next lessons in a few weeks!


Made my heart proud. She looked so nice. Soft, responsive and willing. I probably should have sold her. The clinician said she was looking for one JUST like her :lol: .

Susan
from susamorg on the UDBB

demi
Bringing Life to the DDBB
Posts: 1360
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2015 7:02 pm
Location: Texas

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby demi » Tue Aug 28, 2018 11:25 am

That’s so exciting about Kyra! I think she’s the perfect horse for when you start riding full time again, Susan. It’s so very nice to see how your training is producing excellent results. Sometimes this training we do takes a LOT longer than we like, but I am personally encouraged by you and Kyra.

demi
Bringing Life to the DDBB
Posts: 1360
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2015 7:02 pm
Location: Texas

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby demi » Tue Aug 28, 2018 12:11 pm

Rocky is a good rehab patient. It is so helpful that I have my own place to manage her. It’s also helpful that the injury occurred this time of year when the heat has helped to keep her quiet. I am able to turn her out for several hours a day.

Having Rocky out of commission has made me want to start Emma back so I can have a back up. Yesterday I read my daily notes on Emma’s training through the first year that I had her (2016). It took a couple of hours to read it all and really think about it. I’ll read through 2017’s notes today. She is really quite a handful for an old amateur and I find that my age makes it easier to get discouraged. But I am realizing that even though path has not been smooth, there is still a lot of hope. I’m not going to make specific goals for her, but rather just keep working on it and see what happens. I have a call into my trainer and the plan is to take her in for an evaluation. Also trainer said she has horses that she can give me lessons on until Rocky is better.

kande50
Bringing Life to the DDBB
Posts: 1671
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2015 7:28 pm
Location: Williamstown, MA

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby kande50 » Tue Aug 28, 2018 4:42 pm

demi wrote:I’m not going to make specific goals for her, but rather just keep working on it and see what happens.


Maybe take it slow and try to direct your thoughts to strategies for staying safer, rather than for getting further faster?

It's not easy because we know what our goals are, and we're surrounded by those who can progress faster (for whatever reasons) so the temptation is to try to do the same. But I think most of us have a little voice in our head that tells us when something we're doing probably isn't a great idea, and we just need to learn to listen to that voice.

That, and Emma's vacation might have helped her to decompress enough so that you could start her over again, with the emphasis on calm this time around, and the outcome might be much different?

Ryeissa
500 post plus club
Posts: 990
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2015 1:41 pm

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby Ryeissa » Tue Aug 28, 2018 5:03 pm

kande50 wrote:
demi wrote:I’m not going to make specific goals for her, but rather just keep working on it and see what happens.


Maybe take it slow and try to direct your thoughts to strategies for staying safer, rather than for getting further faster?


what? it sounds like Demi has an excellent strategy. :lol:

No one here pushes the horses.

Ryeissa
500 post plus club
Posts: 990
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2015 1:41 pm

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby Ryeissa » Tue Aug 28, 2018 5:08 pm

Training is going ok, except my horse is not liking my dressage saddle. why, I have no earthly idea what is the problem....

It's the same exact saddle as my jump saddle (both bought brand new and fitted every 4 months), Same model/brand, down to the seat size, tree, and even the same girth and half pad. It's a real mystery. I circle it back into my rides and within three rides I have a horrid mess. He's not sore, he just hates it. so I have my fitter and an alternate working on this... it's a real puzzle. I do the same work in each saddle. I am going to try to make it a bit softer and less hard, that is the only thing that makes sense.

Making it work with a long jump girth did help since there is no buckle pressing on the sensitive area by his elbow (he's really small so this is a problem). That helped the overall shoulder freedom! step in the right direction

Maybe he just likes brown tack and wants to jump :D

kande50
Bringing Life to the DDBB
Posts: 1671
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2015 7:28 pm
Location: Williamstown, MA

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby kande50 » Tue Aug 28, 2018 5:34 pm

Ryeissa wrote:
No one here pushes the horses.


Of course we push our horses, because we'd never progress if we didn't. The trick is in knowing how much we can push them without regressing rather than progressing.

Horsie meltdowns are the kind of regression that most of us would prefer to avoid, and especially as we become much more likely to get injured when we push past what they can tolerate.

Ryeissa
500 post plus club
Posts: 990
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2015 1:41 pm

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby Ryeissa » Tue Aug 28, 2018 5:37 pm

kande50 wrote:
Ryeissa wrote:
No one here pushes the horses.


Of course we push our horses, because we'd never progress if we didn't. The trick is in knowing how much we can push them without regressing rather than progressing.

Horsie meltdowns are the kind of regression that most of us would prefer to avoid, and especially as we become much more likely to get injured when we push past what they can tolerate.
kande50 wrote:
Ryeissa wrote:
No one here pushes the horses.


Of course we push our horses, because we'd never progress if we didn't. The trick is in knowing how much we can push them without regressing rather than progressing.

Horsie meltdowns are the kind of regression that most of us would prefer to avoid, and especially as we become much more likely to get injured when we push past what they can tolerate.


I meant excessive pushing.

demi
Bringing Life to the DDBB
Posts: 1360
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2015 7:02 pm
Location: Texas

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby demi » Tue Aug 28, 2018 6:25 pm

That’s a curious problem with Riot’s dressage saddle. I’m not sure what you mean by “circling it back in your rides”. Have you tried riding dressage in the jumping saddle?

Ryeissa
500 post plus club
Posts: 990
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2015 1:41 pm

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby Ryeissa » Tue Aug 28, 2018 6:38 pm

demi wrote:That’s a curious problem with Riot’s dressage saddle. I’m not sure what you mean by “circling it back in your rides”. Have you tried riding dressage in the jumping saddle?


I try my dressage saddle every few months and esp again after I just had universal billets put in.

I do dressage in my jump saddle and I get really good connection, collection, and harmony. I have pretty much been using it 100% of the time since May 2018 when I threw in the towel over my dressage saddle. I just need some sort of long term solution for showing 2019 and now that I want to start flying changes and third level (over the winter). My jump saddle is very well balanced and I can sit the trot well so we just went with it.

demi
Bringing Life to the DDBB
Posts: 1360
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2015 7:02 pm
Location: Texas

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby demi » Tue Aug 28, 2018 10:33 pm

kande50 wrote:
demi wrote:I’m not going to make specific goals for her, but rather just keep working on it and see what happens.


Maybe take it slow and try to direct your thoughts to strategies for staying safer, rather than for getting further faster?

It's not easy because we know what our goals are, and we're surrounded by those who can progress faster (for whatever reasons) so the temptation is to try to do the same. But I think most of us have a little voice in our head that tells us when something we're doing probably isn't a great idea, and we just need to learn to listen to that voice.

That, and Emma's vacation might have helped her to decompress enough so that you could start her over again, with the emphasis on calm this time around, and the outcome might be much different?


Yes, no, and sorta :lol:

I need to take it slow for my own safety.

I’m not tempted to try what others are doing, but I have a little voice in my head that i dont always listen to! I’m getting much better with age, however.

Em’s vacation did decompress her a lot but the issues she came with still will have to be dealt with one way or another.

The reason for not setting specific goals is something I got from the Karen Rohlf program. Instead of saying “I’ll do ——-fill in the blank—-today”, I say “maybe today”. It relieves pressure on myself and in turn on my horse. I think part of Emma’s problem was that she was pressured too much. And that goes along with something you said here:
kande50 wrote:
Ryeissa wrote:
No one here pushes the horses.


Of course we push our horses, because we'd never progress if we didn't. The trick is in knowing how much we can push them without regressing rather than progressing.

Horsie meltdowns are the kind of regression that most of us would prefer to avoid, and especially as we become much more likely to get injured when we push past what they can tolerate.


Knowing how much to push or pressure without going overboard is tricky. Even pros can mess up so how much more so an amateur.

User avatar
Chisamba
Bringing Life to the DDBB
Posts: 2609
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2015 10:33 pm
Location: New Jersey

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby Chisamba » Wed Aug 29, 2018 3:32 am

When deciding how much to.push, I h as ve learned to watch the herd dynamic. Does that sound goofy ? Well if I have a horse that is very calm in the herd, I offer low pressure progression, if it's a horse that is either highly alpha, or pushed hard by the alpha mare, i push harder.

Karma was a rescue. She would kick at the leg, toss her head, she dished her tail to every sid. I thought the poor mare was in pain. I had her back, her hocks, her teeth, everything checked out. No evident issues were found. Then I moved her to the big field, five horses etc. Now Karma is always bottom of the pack, but oh, they bullied her. Did not just chase her, I mean teeth bared galloped and chased her. Over and over. Now Deneb is bossy, but she is not a mean mare, so watching this surprised me. Fortunately, after a few hours no injuries and all sorted. I didnt really associate this immediately with training, but one day while grooming Karma in x ties, which she loves and is very super relaxed about, I saw a huge fly land on her and bite her, before I could kill it. It bit so hard that a little dribble of blood ran down. Karma didn't buck, swish, toss her head or anything and I though, it's not pain, she is not a super sensitive horse, its attitude. So i got on her and put on real pressure for five minutes, any time she tossed, swishes or kicked out, we went forward into more contact. It started to show dividends almost immediately but it took several rides to really show me that all of her reactivity was attitude. No pain, not sensitivity, just rude. I was finally able to adopt her out this year. I am a bit thick because it was nearly ten years of looking for pain, lightening aids, being kind, and what she needed was ri be sent forward with a bit of pressure any time she had attitude.

Deneb otoh is the opposite. Apply too much pressure , even subtle pressure, and she reacts and often the result is dangerous.

So we do pressurize our horses, I am sure we all do, because progress requires a reason (to the horse) so balance of pressure and reward , but how much can often be seen best when watching the herd dynamic at liberty. Jmho

Edited to add. The horse that is constantly play fighting, or trying to climb the herd ladder, or challenging others in play, that horse needs to be ridden wet attitude.

The horse that quickly established herd order, be it top, middle or bottom. Quietly waits its feed turn, doesnt rush the gate at time to bring in, that horse responds to quiet relaxed low pressure training best.

kande50
Bringing Life to the DDBB
Posts: 1671
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2015 7:28 pm
Location: Williamstown, MA

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby kande50 » Wed Aug 29, 2018 10:15 am

demi wrote:
I’m not tempted to try what others are doing, but I have a little voice in my head that i dont always listen to! I’m getting much better with age, however.


It's been difficult for me to learn to listen too, because I've spent so many years pushing through any doubts that it hasn't been easy to change that mindset. What has really helped me with that has been riding by myself, because I'm so much less distracted so I pay much closer attention to my horse's reactions, which makes me much less likely to miss the signals that predict the meltdowns.

Em’s vacation did decompress her a lot but the issues she came with still will have to be dealt with one way or another.


I think one of the big challenges with horses is that what works well for one horse-rider combo doesn't necessarily work well for another, so your biggest challenge with Emma may be to find out what works for her?

Knowing how much to push or pressure without going overboard is tricky. Even pros can mess up so how much more so an amateur.


That's it exactly. It was different when we were younger and more resiliant because if we pushed too hard and the horse melted down it wasn't a big deal because we just picked ourselves up, learned what we needed to learn from the experience, and carried on. Now unfortunately (or maybe fortunately) the picking up and carrying on has become a much bigger deal.

User avatar
Rosie B
500 post plus club
Posts: 560
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2015 11:38 pm

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby Rosie B » Wed Aug 29, 2018 12:03 pm

Chisamba - that is extremely insightful, and I've never heard or considered anything like that before. I'll need to think about that. Thank-you.

Tsavo
Bringing Life to the DDBB
Posts: 1431
Joined: Wed May 25, 2016 2:01 am

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby Tsavo » Wed Aug 29, 2018 12:32 pm

I agree that was insightful, Chisamba. But I apply that to the horse I ride who sometimes bucks at canter and I am still at a loss to know if it is physical or behavior.

demi
Bringing Life to the DDBB
Posts: 1360
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2015 7:02 pm
Location: Texas

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby demi » Wed Aug 29, 2018 12:44 pm

Rosie B wrote:Chisamba - that is extremely insightful, and I've never heard or considered anything like that before. I'll need to think about that. Thank-you.


Very insightful, I agree. I am amazed that some of the trainers I've worked with pay so little attention to that kind of information about horses. I can think of two experienced GP trainers that I worked with for a year each that wouldn't even enter into conversation about such things. As I think about it, neither one turned horses out in groups, in fact, their horses got very little turnout time at all.

I, too, need to think about this some more and am interested in discussion about it.

Tsavo
Bringing Life to the DDBB
Posts: 1431
Joined: Wed May 25, 2016 2:01 am

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby Tsavo » Wed Aug 29, 2018 12:51 pm

The other thing is I had my horse out with another horse and that other horse would bite my horse. It never stopped week after week. I won't have that. So now I am wondering how often things calm down like with Chisamba's example and how often they never do like with my horse.

piedmontfields
Bringing Life to the DDBB
Posts: 1728
Joined: Mon Oct 19, 2015 4:41 pm
Location: E Tennessee USA

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby piedmontfields » Wed Aug 29, 2018 1:56 pm

Very interesting comments on pressure. My experience echoes Chiasamba's description. I have a physically very tough, sturdy mare whom I can push physically quite a bit. Mentally, she is much softer (fearful, needs clear guidance, calm low key repetition helps her).

I've mentioned in other threads that I am working hard trying to learn to canter :-). So I thought I'd share this funny photo of me sweating, pushing up my glasses and thinking about my hips while cantering one-handed.

sweaty one handed canter.jpg
sweaty one handed canter.jpg (194.65 KiB) Viewed 846 times


And here's a little more composed photo at trot where I am clearly too much in the back seat!

trot right.jpg
trot right.jpg (169.17 KiB) Viewed 846 times


And here's a posting trot shot since that has been a topic over the summer, too!
Posting trot-1.jpg
Posting trot-1.jpg (210.78 KiB) Viewed 835 times


Of course in video and stills, I notice all of the things I struggle with. It would really help if I picked up the reins a bit and dropped my heels! The best thing about watching video of rides is seeing that Em is very sound and she swings her tail very rhythmically in all gaits (hey, I've got to notice something positive, right?!).
Last edited by piedmontfields on Thu Aug 30, 2018 2:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Ryeissa
500 post plus club
Posts: 990
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2015 1:41 pm

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby Ryeissa » Wed Aug 29, 2018 3:50 pm

Love those shots! Very heartwarming to know I'm not alone and the struggle is real.

khall
Bringing Life to the DDBB
Posts: 1136
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2015 1:47 am

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby khall » Wed Aug 29, 2018 5:56 pm

Chisamba your observations would not fit my horses, especially Rip. I do feel that how a horse interacts in a herd situation can be dependent on their background. Those who have been raised in a herd that is mixed ages and genders IMO is one of the best ways to raise a young horse. Rip has been out with older horses and young horses, mares and geldings (funny to see this big 2 yr old WB do smacky mouth to a tiny Arabian g!) So many horses though have not been exposed to a variety of horses and are kind of emotionally and socially stunted around other horses. So Rip now is the dominant horse in his pasture, would be dominant period to any of the horses on the farm. Yet he is not a tyrant in the field. To work with him it has to be very black and white, no wiggle room. He has become much more sensitive with training but was not his natural MO. Both Rip and his sister Gaila are not the most sensitive of horses and not the most goey of horses, their dam is more goey but is pretty tolerant and much kinder than Rip and even Gaila. Rip takes any wishy washy as an opening to take over. Gaila not quite as difficult, but still is very much the WB temperament. Gallie surprisingly is very tolerant and kind and makes an awesome schoolmistress because of this.

Because I have the horses on my own farm I get to make the decisions as to who goes out with who. If there is trouble I will not usually just leave it to sort it out, I will rearrange so that each horse is comfortable in their TO. I do watch all of the horses which can be rather boring since they are pretty much just out grazing, I also like to go into the fields and interact with them, even working them out with other horses in their field.

Piedmont I love your mare!! Nice solid girl and she looks like fun:) The canter picture is hilarious.

So I did have Rip dialed in and now he is back out again. Bringing his shenanigans to the table and making me work harder for what we were getting. Still getting good stuff I just am having to be much more "tough" in my asking, more demanding of him. Kind of typical of Rip, what can I do to get away with stuff. Spooking is one of his go to's. So was riding the other day and could feel it coming and stupid me should have been more proactive to prevent it. I tell you after this horse most others will be a breeze! So I did learn what to do better, pretty big spook but went back to work and was fine. I end up riding with stronger seat and aids ON when he is like this. So today he was being similar but was more about just not paying attention or actually a bit of challenge there. Again I have just got to sit down and ride the sucker when he is like this. Yes you can pay attention and can do as I ask, which he did once I put the demands on him no problem. I have no idea why one day he is a gem, answering every questions easily and quickly and then the next day he is a challenge. Jerked my back with the spook dang him.

So what do you guys do riding a spooky horse or challenging horses? Any insights into my beastie? HIs nick name was shit head as a young horse for a reason!

piedmontfields
Bringing Life to the DDBB
Posts: 1728
Joined: Mon Oct 19, 2015 4:41 pm
Location: E Tennessee USA

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby piedmontfields » Wed Aug 29, 2018 6:10 pm

khall wrote: So many horses though have not been exposed to a variety of horses and are kind of emotionally and socially stunted around other horses.


This describes Emi's past perfectly. She is socially stunted, and even gets quite panicky when horses she doesn't know well are anywhere in the vicinity. I got her when she was 12 and don't think I'll ever shift her behavior that much. She is doing well now in a "socially-designed" solo turnout environment, where she is surrounded by a rotating cast of neighboring eventer boyfriends :lol:

khall wrote: So what do you guys do riding a spooky horse or challenging horses? Any insights into my beastie? HIs nick name was shit head as a young horse for a reason!


I think you are dealing with a challenging personality + spooky behavior with Rip---which is truly work. I think some of these types are among the more talented horses, but you have to provide the management framework (constantly).

My mare is actually quite spooky (hard for some to believe, because she looks so quiet), but she is also not challenging and is willing to trust me. That makes her quite easy for me to ride. Last night we were out in the woods for an hour with various wildlife sightings and flushes. I think if she had the wrong rider she could get panicky, but with a calm, reassuring rider she is much more likely to just "alert" rather than do a full blown spook. And I like that she alerts me to nearby wildlife or other weirdness that lurks!

Ryeissa
500 post plus club
Posts: 990
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2015 1:41 pm

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby Ryeissa » Wed Aug 29, 2018 8:47 pm

It's interesting, my horse acts completely different in various pasture situations. So at times he's more playful and other times he's a little more pushy depending on if the other herd mates are submissive or also aggressive. My Interactions with him are very consistent, regardless of what barn we are at.

exvet
Herd Member
Posts: 303
Joined: Tue Oct 20, 2015 12:28 pm
Location: Phoenix

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby exvet » Wed Aug 29, 2018 11:43 pm

I find the discussion of how much pressure to apply to a horse quite interesting. I had another fantastic lesson today despite Junior coming off the trailer in quite a heightened bit of a tizzy. He loaded great and actually unloaded like a gentleman but he was getting eaten up by flies and mosquitoes despite chemical measures taken. He was just a powder keg and I don't blame him. When I entered the arena I told my riding instructor that I really wasn't sure what type of lesson we were going to have......then 6 horses, believe it or not, all greys, entered the arena to ride at the same time. I was already mounted by the time the crowd came; but, Junior started whinnying. I really thought I was going to get little out of the lesson other than a character building session for us both. Well I put him to work very quickly and the more demands and upping the ante I did, the more he stepped up to the plate. I certainly didn't ask him for anything he wasn't strong enough to handle. I did become more demanding and exacting with the requests and expectations. He is a stubborn little cuss; but, he's willing to work as long as the request is clear and fair and that includes pushing the envelope. His ponytude comes out occasionally, not every ride but often enough, and as long as I'm there to meet it (and then some) we have, so far, progressed in a positive direction. I just know that I have to make sure that if I'm applying pressure, I absolutely must think through all possible outcomes and be prepared to handle any of them so that I can direct the ending/finish in a way that is positive even if the road might be a little bumpy on the way to that finish. As long as I'm the leader in the interaction, we seem to do alright. He's an in your face kind of guy to the other horses and takes quite a beating but keeps coming back for more......so I think I'm on the right path. My riding instructor (an L grad who's currently competing at grand prix) was giving us 8's on all our gaits today which is better than our last lesson.....we also started working on first level movements (I had already been doing them at home).

demi
Bringing Life to the DDBB
Posts: 1360
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2015 7:02 pm
Location: Texas

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby demi » Thu Aug 30, 2018 12:06 am

I love the pics, Piedmont! At very first glance at the pic where you were pushing up your glasses, I thought you were doing the facepalm :lol: I feel like doing that sometimes myself when I’m riding.

I like the way you were posting the trot in the last pic. Not too high out of the saddle on the rise. Personally, I think it is more harmonious and a closer contact to post that way. Of course a lot of things have to be going well to be able to post like that, but I feel so connected to my horse when I can let her push me out of the saddle in the rising part, and then engage myself somehow to sit back down. It’s a neat interaction with the horse, like casually tossing a ball back and forth.

You may feel something that I dont see, but I didnt think your heels needed to be dropped anymore in that last pic. Also, Emi is really stepping under you, and to me that says she is responding to your correctly balanced weight. I liked it.

Emi looks wonderful! Thanks for posting.

Kyra's Mom
500 post plus club
Posts: 559
Joined: Tue Oct 20, 2015 2:04 am
Location: Sunny? Southern Idaho

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby Kyra's Mom » Thu Aug 30, 2018 4:07 am

Well, I finally got out to the barn...eager to try my "liberty sticks". The company that makes the Hybrid halters had these. They had an oops and ordered too many I guess so they were selling the pair for $25 instead of $25 each. They are a nice very light "wand". One is a longer shaft with a shorter lash and the other is the opposite.

They worked very well with Ms. K. We had a bang up round pen session. They extend the length of your arms and being so light, they are quick and efficient. Much lighter than a "carrot" type stick or even regular whip. They are nice quality and have replaceable lashes.

I got very nice trot work with lots of nice stretch...and even side to side. Normally to the right, she just doesn't stretch as deep. Her right hind is the weaker one. Not tonight. Very even side to side. Karen R calls it letting loose and she certainly did that tonight. We did some canter/trot/canter and walk to canter. Then, just for kicks and giggles, I had her back up and canter off. She is getting so much rounder and not using her neck to heft herself into canter.

She was able to do leg yield on the circle without me touching her and guiding her and slowing her shoulder as needed with the sticks. Then for the kicker, lets try some half steps. I got some lovely effort simply by limiting her forward movement with one stick at chest level and tapping her haunch with the shorter one. She just draped into a lovely correct position and a few nicely diagonal steps with no strings attached :mrgreen: .

She seemed genuinely pleased with herself and actually, was much calmer and apt to stick with me with the two sticks. A lot of times she will spin away from me...me not being quick enough to prevent the spin. With the two sticks, my reach is extended on each side so I think these will be nice little tools to further our liberty work.

Straightforward's lesson was proof to me that dedicated ground work aimed at her posture and carriage, really helps the under saddle work. Yes, SF gets lots of credit for her correct and sympathetic riding but this horse hasn't had but maybe 75-100 rides under saddle in the last 3 YEARS. Something is working ;) .

Susan
from susamorg on the UDBB

piedmontfields
Bringing Life to the DDBB
Posts: 1728
Joined: Mon Oct 19, 2015 4:41 pm
Location: E Tennessee USA

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby piedmontfields » Thu Aug 30, 2018 10:54 am

Kyra's Mom wrote: Straightforward's lesson was proof to me that dedicated ground work aimed at her posture and carriage, really helps the under saddle work. Yes, SF gets lots of credit for her correct and sympathetic riding but this horse hasn't had but maybe 75-100 rides under saddle in the last 3 YEARS. Something is working ;) .


Indeed! That and your recent session are wonderful evidence of good work! It's so awesome that SF can help you out and Kyra can help her out. I've really enjoyed your updates and insights.

User avatar
Chisamba
Bringing Life to the DDBB
Posts: 2609
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2015 10:33 pm
Location: New Jersey

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby Chisamba » Thu Aug 30, 2018 12:06 pm

Rosie B wrote:Chisamba - that is extremely insightful, and I've never heard or considered anything like that before. I'll need to think about that. Thank-you.


It's not the only clue, just one of many, and I think is more applicable to mares.

Age and gender also matters, a gelding as sweet and amiable at four can become very challenging at seven, even without testicles the instinct to reproduce makes them be more challenging as they reach full maturity.

Of course, as Khall said, their history of life and what they have learned also matters.

I suppose my most significant experiences would say I serve the horse as a whole. How it behaves with horses us part, how it behaves with humans is part, and how it responds to you is part. If you are lucky enough to have a long history with your horses, easier.

If you take on problem and rescue horses with no know history, the herd dynamic is very helpful.

Ponichiwa
Herd Member
Posts: 486
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2015 2:27 pm

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby Ponichiwa » Thu Aug 30, 2018 12:14 pm

Piedmontfields-- lovely photos. Your mare is a cutie! And Rye-- Riot is such a striking guy. You and he look very happy together.

Well, it's basically wrap-up time. Here's what I said I'd do:
Ponichiwa wrote:So, for the next 9ish weeks, here's what we'll be working on:
- Canter: school 1/4 and 1/3 pirouettes 1x/week
- Trot: Halfsteps to trot extensions 2x/month
- Halt-trot-halt transitions every ride (turns out I haven't been riding those nearly enough)

For me:
- 15k steps/day
- Track food intake for 2 months
- Work out before or after work 3x/week


Happy to report I've done all the above. Down 7lb, Kiwi is on track for polishing the 4th level work just in time for the tests to change. I'm for sure adding goals for this little guy next time:

Image

Image

User avatar
Flight
Bringing Life to the DDBB
Posts: 1107
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2015 11:39 pm
Location: Australia

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby Flight » Thu Aug 30, 2018 12:20 pm

PIedmontfields - nice pics, your horse looks happy and relaxed.

I had a comp on the weekend, and interesting that I got chipped for a stiff connection after all I said on that other thread :oops:
I think I still over ride in a competition, I need to learn to relax. Still, got some nice pics :)

edited to add pics. I think I also consciously shortened my reins, because in the past if I let them a bit loose I get the comments 'not into the bridle' and I pushed him a little bit too much for impulsion. So, it might have looked a bit tight. I'm ok with it, just something more to work on :roll: :D

Ponichiwa - nice work for meeting your goals , and cute pics :)


dingss.jpg
dingss.jpg (94.72 KiB) Viewed 649 times

dingss1.jpg
dingss1.jpg (83.75 KiB) Viewed 649 times
Last edited by Flight on Thu Aug 30, 2018 10:59 pm, edited 2 times in total.

User avatar
musical comedy
500 post plus club
Posts: 951
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2015 3:41 pm
Location: New Jersey

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby musical comedy » Thu Aug 30, 2018 1:10 pm

Flight wrote:I had a comp on the weekend, and interesting that I got chipped for a stiff connection after all I said on that other thread :oops:
I think I still over ride in a competition, I need to learn to relax. Still, got some nice pics :)
Stiff connection? I don't see that ever on any of your videos or photos. What is a stiff connection?

kande50
Bringing Life to the DDBB
Posts: 1671
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2015 7:28 pm
Location: Williamstown, MA

Re: Are we ready for the July August goals thread?

Postby kande50 » Thu Aug 30, 2018 1:33 pm

piedmontfields wrote:The best thing about watching video of rides is seeing that Em is very sound and she swings her tail very rhythmically in all gaits (hey, I've got to notice something positive, right?!).


I think the swinging tail is important because it's easy to see on video, and gives us important information about how the horse is moving.

I also look at the poll to make sure it stays the highest point, and the hind legs, to make sure they're not hesitating or hovering. In fact, learning to look at the movement of the hinds has helped me the most, because as soon as I started to be able to see if they were actually loading more vs just hovering more, that gave me important information about whether we were headed toward true collection vs pseudo-collection.


Return to “Dressage Training”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 12 guests