Stirrup Positioning

[PhoenixRising]

Last night during my lesson I asked my trainer about posting, because I felt like I was posting too much from my feet. Starting to break it down, we realized I've been pretty much riding on my toes instead of the balls of my feet. Moved the stirrup back a bit further to see how that felt and it felt SO WERID . We played with it some, and trainer feels like my calf was able to hug the horse more when the stirrup was more on the balls of my feet, and less so when it was toward the toes. Have any of you ever noticed anything like this? Does it make sense mechanically to anyone?

[piedmontfields]

This makes sense to me, as the calf is less "bulked" and less in position when you are more on the toes rather than on the ball of the foot.

When I'm in the right place posting, it is easy for me to keep my calf on the horse and it is easy for me to drop and pick up my stirrups.

Posting trot is hard!

[heddylamar]

Yes! I have a tendency to only slip my toes into the stirrups. In a jumping saddle with a shorter stirrup length, toe-only is fine for me — my legs are very stable with or without my toes in the stirrups. But, in the dressage saddle with a longer stirrup I realize immediately that my leg is unstable and reposition my foot.

I also have really long toes, and the balls of my feet are actually behind the wider part of the toe box on every shoe, so even if it looks like I'm on the balls of my feet, odds are I'm not.

[musical comedy]

If you read the experts (which most of you do), you'll find differing opinions on this. As I recall, DeKunffy is a toes on the stirrup person. I've always disliked the term 'bulk the calf' (not meaning to offend Piedmont) because in stiff dressage boots a horse can't tell if the calf is bulked or not. Personally, as I've written many times before, I loathe posting trot and do as little as possible. For me, it is very difficult. I also would so love to have just my toes on the irons and heel down. I'm one of those (like a beginner) that ends up with the foot too much into the stirrup.

Posting trot for me is done in warmup and some cool down only. In sitting trot, I keep my leg loose/off. That's another thing that is controversial.

[piedmontfields]

As I recall, DeKunffy is a toes on the stirrup person.

Yes, he is. Some people seem able to do that beautifully...I cannot...I am quite tight these days, so even keeping the heel down a centimeter takes some effort.

Heddy, that is a good example of our personal conformation intersecting with riding ideals and functional reality!

I've always disliked the term 'bulk the calf' (not meaning to offend Piedmont) because in stiff dressage boots a horse can't tell if the calf is bulked or not.

That is an interesting point! I am curious about how "how loose" your legs are in sitting trot. I think I tend to be looser in the leg in working and medium gaits and more "leg on" in collected work.

[Tanga]

Absolutely. If you are on your toe, you are creating a pivot point which you lose your balance from. The ball allows the leg to get longer and the calf to get on. As a long legged person, I more get the feel of my calf under the barrel.

As for DeKunffy, I would never call him an expert. I knew him and he lived around here. He wrote many books and he had many theories, but little actual knowledge from practical application. He came from Hungary as an 18 year old groom and that was his big experience.

musical comedy, I'm with you on disliking posting trot. Maybe it's because of my back, but it's uncomfortable. I don't think keeping a loose leg is controversial in sitting. I don't know how you keep it off, but maybe you just mean loose by that. The leg should be loose/quiet/following unless it's working to do something. Gripping nonstop or bumping or kicking every step is something no one should do.

[Chisamba]

deKunffy has a beautiful direct release over a jump, or had! but that said i was not a fan of his dressage teachings either.

I ride a touch shorter in the stirrup than dressage popular, and a level foot i guess, but stirrup to the ball, for 55 years of riding i have had to remind myself to point my toe forward not outward and use my calf more and my heel less. i even had spurs with those nubbles to the inside but they are not dressage legal

anyway, i find that people are so different in their leg shapes, length of thigh, shape of thigh, shape of horse, everything really changes how the leg lies on a horse, so i feel kind of like the "rules" of leg position are more suggestions . shhhhhh dont tell the SRS clinicians that

[Tanga]

Agreed Chisamba. Every single person has to ride differently for their own body shape and their own horse. I think that's actually a hard concept to learn, and it's even harder to figure out how you need to ride with your own body.

[StraightForward]

anyway, i find that people are so different in their leg shapes, length of thigh, shape of thigh, shape of horse, everything really changes how the leg lies on a horse, so i feel kind of like the "rules" of leg position are more suggestions . shhhhhh dont tell the SRS clinicians that

Yes, it's all about finding that balance point, and people have different ratios of foot : shin : femur length, and then add in different stirrup bar positioning, etc.

With a greener horse, I tend to ride with the stirrup more on the ball of my foot for security, and with a well broke horse, I keep it more at the front of the ball of my foot, which allows me to keep my lower leg back and not much weight in the stirrup, even when posting. It's also different for me wearing stiff boots that support my ankle vs. soft boots or half chaps.

[Tsavo]

As for DeKunffy, I would never call him an expert. I knew him and he lived around here. He wrote many books and he had many theories, but little actual knowledge from practical application. He came from Hungary as an 18 year old groom and that was his big experience.

Little anecdote... one of the people I have worked with who is an FEI trainer took a clinic with deKunffy. She could not get her horse to do something he asked her to do. She asked if he would get on her horse and do the exercise. He did and was successful. I don't remember what the exercise was.

[musical comedy]

That is an interesting point! I am curious about how "how loose" your legs are in sitting trot. I think I tend to be looser in the leg in working and medium gaits and more "leg on" in collected work.

I am back on this thread because I am changing what I do. Could it be that I don't even know what I do/did, or maybe things are changing. Who knows. What I can tell you is that of late if do not have a loose leg at sitting trot. Quite the opposite really. That is not to say I am using a leg actively to say 'go'. No. It's a supporting leg. It's not a busy leg. I can't put feelings into words like some of you can.

I also want to say that I think getting a horse through and starting collection is hard work for the rider. I remember a good while ago, maybe on udbb, a poster was saying dressage shouldn't be work (I think it was tsavo ). Well, maybe it isn't work for a very fit and talented rider or some 6 foot tall man. I think you have to take into consideration the fitness of the rider and the difficulty of the horse to determine what kind of strength is required. I'm obviously old and not very strong, so in order to maintain with my core, keep the horse in front of the leg, and re-balanced takes a lot of effort on my part. My top is wet when I finish as is the back waistband of my breeches.

Sorry to put this on stirrup stepping thread, but that is where I wanted to make the change in what I wrote.

[StraightForward]

MC - at the Melonie Kessler clinic a few weeks ago, she was talking about still legs. One rider had very wobbly lower legs, and she said to make them more still. Certainly that requires a certain amount of muscle tone. The motion has to be absorbed somewhere, and if the body is lax, the movement will travel out through the extremities.

I agree on having to go through a "work" phase - even though Kyra is a lighter horse, it took some relatively stronger riding to get her collecting. Now she is back to being light and is a lot less work to ride. I do find I need to keep the muscle tone and feeling of forward direction to keep an active working trot - I think this has to do with maintaining some cadence, rather than just going along for the ride, in which the speed or energy might be similar, but there is not enough trot quality. In time, maybe the cadenced trot would be her default and I could use less tone in my body and she would still maintain. Not sure yet. Also, I think very fit people are using more tone than they think, by default - e.g. Dresseur's observation of coming back to riding with less leg strength and needing to re-calibrate. So these strong riders say something is easy - while what might take 10% effort for them might be a 50% muscular effort for someone with less strength.

[Dresseur]

About the still legs... a lot of times if there is looseness in the extremities, there's a deficit in how the core is being used. The one good thing about this hip injury is that I've gotten very, very targeted core exercises. I used to have a slight wobble in the ankle that drove me nuts. Suddenly, I don't have it any more.

[Ryeissa]

About the still legs... a lot of times if there is looseness in the extremities, there's a deficit in how the core is being used. .

I found this to be true in my riding too

[Chisamba]

i do not really think about some of these things. like is my leg loose, where do i keep the stirrup, etc, so i went and looked at some of the video. to really look at my leg, yes i pretty much keep the stirrup on the ball of the foot, i have enough contact with the stirrup so that when i move my leg back to half pass or some such thing the stirrup moves with my leg and stays on the ball. I do not seem to have a lot of movement in my leg, unless the horse does not respond the way i would like then i am guilty of the double tap. i also noticed that my leg does not move position from posting trot to sitting trot and back.

i am not offended by the term " bulk the calf" i know that my horse can feel "something" when i depress my heel more. it might not be feeling my calf, but it feels enough of something to respond. my position could be better, but I am able to be consistent enough and manage well enough to transmit aids that my horse understands.

[KathyK]

As for DeKunffy, I would never call him an expert. I knew him and he lived around here. He wrote many books and he had many theories, but little actual knowledge from practical application. He came from Hungary as an 18 year old groom and that was his big experience.

This is a very odd statement. Even if it were true (and I think it is not), certainly he gained a lot of experience after the age of 18.

[Ryeissa]

As for DeKunffy, I would never call him an expert. I knew him and he lived around here. He wrote many books and he had many theories, but little actual knowledge from practical application. He came from Hungary as an 18 year old groom and that was his big experience.

This is a very odd statement. Even if it were true (and I think it is not), certainly he gained a lot of experience after the age of 18.

Totally agree. I am very confused by this. If he isn't an expert than who would be?

[KathyK]

Retired "S" judge, inducted into the USDF Hall of Fame in 2013, J.J. Tate's mentor. Pretty good for a groom.

[piedmontfields]

I really enjoy and appreciate CdeK but am aware that not everyone does.

[Chisamba]

I think that Tanga is asking what his qualifications actually are, other than being erudite.

[KathyK]

Tanga didn't ask anything, just made a statement.

[Ryeissa]

Absolutely. If you are on your toe, you are creating a pivot point which you lose your balance from. The ball allows the leg to get longer and the calf to get on. As a long legged person, I more get the feel of my calf under the barrel.

As for DeKunffy, I would never call him an expert. I knew him and he lived around here. He wrote many books and he had many theories, but little actual knowledge from practical application. He came from Hungary as an 18 year old groom and that was his big experience.

musical comedy, I'm with you on disliking posting trot. Maybe it's because of my back, but it's uncomfortable. I don't think keeping a loose leg is controversial in sitting. I don't know how you keep it off, but maybe you just mean loose by that. The leg should be loose/quiet/following unless it's working to do something. Gripping nonstop or bumping or kicking every step is something no one should do.

Here is the full post, it's very clear she doesn't think he is an expert. I am honestly puzzled by this as he is one of the most passionate about horse welfare and classical riding. with Tanga's scorn for Isabel werth and the state of dressage today, wouldn't we want to all encourage those who do train and teach in a "horse first" correct way?

It's true he wasn't in the olympics and such, but that doesn't bother me. Maybe that is the sticking point with Tanga. I guess not every style of teacher will speak to every student. Perhaps Tanga needs more direct translation. However, that does not invalidate his status before his recent passing.

I also think he is and was marketing in a different way to be more artistic and less focused on one specific horse or event. Again, it might work for you or not

[Tanga]

This is weird. My reply disappeared. I would not call DeKunnfy an expert. He talks and a lot and repeats a lot of theory. He has not applied it or lived it, taught it or rode it. When I did the L program, he would say things that sounded really good in theory, but in application, they didn't work. I know a few people like this who talk about theories and ideas, but never trained it, competed it, etc. I don't take an opinion as an expert from someone who says how to train, ride, and show a . . . whatever . . . when they've never done it. Many people who have any kind of experience can give opinions and feedback, but that doesn't make them an expert. If you like him and the marketing, fine.

And, Ryeissa, discussing issues is not "scorn." I pointed out the consistent issues with IW's trot and shared the video and REPEATEDLY said dressage is much better than it was. The idea was to discuss something Your interpretation that my thread title was not focusing on this one little thing and seeing it all as "scorn" is a your insistence on calling it that and not what I wrote.

[Ryeissa]

This is weird. My reply disappeared. I would not call DeKunnfy an expert. He talks and a lot and repeats a lot of theory. He has not applied it or lived it, taught it or rode it. When I did the L program, he would say things that sounded really good in theory, but in application, they didn't work. I know a few people like this who talk about theories and ideas, but never trained it, competed it, etc. I don't take an opinion as an expert from someone who says how to train, ride, and show a . . . whatever . . . when they've never done it. Many people who have any kind of experience can give opinions and feedback, but that doesn't make them an expert. If you like him and the marketing, fine.

And, Ryeissa, discussing issues is not "scorn." I pointed out the consistent issues with IW's trot and shared the video and REPEATEDLY said dressage is much better than it was. The idea was to discuss something Your interpretation that my thread title was not focusing on this one little thing and seeing it all as "scorn" is a your insistence on calling it that and not what I wrote.

yeah, that was my understanding based on what I wrote. you don't seem to have anything nice to say about IW and that there is a huge judging problem, she rides lame horses and doesn't earn the medals. Remember that we all know your old username and we develop tone based on history, how you describe things, etc. You are not a new poster who happened to pop up one day. The way you were both negative about IW and also negative about CDK seems strange-

who do you like? who is acceptable to you?

He also passed away so it's all past tense.

Thanks for clarifying that experts to you are people who ride and train, that makes more sense.

[musical comedy]

we develop tone based on history

[KathyK]

This is weird. My reply disappeared. I would not call DeKunnfy an expert. He talks and a lot and repeats a lot of theory. He has not applied it or lived it, taught it or rode it. When I did the L program, he would say things that sounded really good in theory, but in application, they didn't work. I know a few people like this who talk about theories and ideas, but never trained it, competed it, etc. I don't take an opinion as an expert from someone who says how to train, ride, and show a . . . whatever . . . when they've never done it. Many people who have any kind of experience can give opinions and feedback, but that doesn't make them an expert. If you like him and the marketing, fine.

And, Ryeissa, discussing issues is not "scorn." I pointed out the consistent issues with IW's trot and shared the video and REPEATEDLY said dressage is much better than it was. The idea was to discuss something Your interpretation that my thread title was not focusing on this one little thing and seeing it all as "scorn" is a your insistence on calling it that and not what I wrote.

yeah, that was my understanding based on what I wrote. you don't seem to have anything nice to say about IW and that there is a huge judging problem, she rides lame horses and doesn't earn the medals. Remember that we all know your old username and we develop tone based on history, how you describe things, etc. You are not a new poster who happened to pop up one day. The way you were both negative about IW and also negative about CDK seems strange-

who do you like? who is acceptable to you?

He also passed away so it's all past tense.

Thanks for clarifying that experts to you are people who ride and train, that makes more sense.

Fortunately, CdK is alive and well.

Tanga is correct that he doesn't ride. Of course he doesn't, HE'S 83. I don't know where Tanga's "information" is coming from, but I have audited at least a dozen CdK clinics, watching dozens and dozens of rides, and cannot recall an instance where there was not marked improvement in the horse, and often the rider as well. My former trainer is a long-time student of CdK and with his guidance took her old horse from second level to a Regional I-1 championship, and has brought her present horse, purchased as a yearling and now 11, to PSG.

Anyone is perfectly entitled not to care for CdK, but to say that he does not know how to ride and train is just wrong, and ridiculous to boot.

[Ryeissa]

Ah, I was thinking Walter Zetti (who did die!) My apologies.....

[Tanga]

Anyone is perfectly entitled not to care for CdK, but to say that he does not know how to ride and train is just wrong, and ridiculous to boot.

So, I won't bother to continue clarifying since some people just want to argue. My take on being critical and discussions is that "criticism" literally means to look at something closely and carefully. And since the VIDEO someone else posted was all about IW, that's the focus. Never once did I say I didn't like IW, but people will clearly interpret whatever they want no matter what I say. Who do I like? I like most of the top riders (and sure am not going to discuss anyone but them because that is not cool.) There are so many good people now. The riding and the horses are exponentially better than 10, 20, 30 years ago. But, I like to discuss the issues and talk about things instead of just always saying how good things are. So rather than just list a whole bunch of good things about everyone, which I could do all day, I can focus on the "problems." While I think Hans Peter is a great rider and I love Edward Gal, I do not like the frantic way the horse is looking in the riding recently.

And interpreting what I said about CdK wrongly is not going to make any difference. If you like him, great. I do NOT consider him an expert. I consider people who are experts people who have ACTUALLY RIDDEN and brought horses on their own up the levels, shown up the levels and coached people at the highest level. You can say what you want, he has not. Has he been on horse? Yes. Has he trained/ridden horses up the levels. No. Has he shown at all? Actually I don't know. I'm not aware he has. Has he coached people? Yes. Has he coached people up to the top levels? No.

Do you understand the difference? Who is an expert who has repeatedly brought horses up the levels, shown up the levels, and coached up the levels? Isabel Werth, Steffen Peters, Hilda Gurney, Guenter Seidel, Kyra Kyrklund, Debbie McDonald, and I could go on and on and on and on and on listing people that are experts that I am aware of.

Perhaps people bothers by critical thinking and discussion should just start and be involved in threads that's only about "good" so it doesn't bother you? There could be many threads--best coaches, best riders, best tempi changes, best half passes, best bringing them up the levels, etc.

[KathyK]

Has he coached people up to the top levels? No.

Wrong. https://www.team-tatedressage.com/get-to-know-jj

You make statements that aren't true, then accuse me of arguing when I say they aren't true. I've had enough of this silliness.

[Tanga]

Has he coached people up to the top levels? No.

Wrong. https://www.team-tatedressage.com/get-to-know-jj

You make statements that aren't true, then accuse me of arguing when I say they aren't true. I've had enough of this silliness.

You can say whatever you want. I have no clue who JJ Tate is, and she certainly has not been in top sport, like on international teams, and in the link you presented, it sure looks like she rode with quite a few actual experts. It's interesting. In any other discussion I've ever been in about him and said the same thing, it's always the exact same answer of JJ Tate. I'm sure she's a lovely rider. Never heard of her.

Have fun riding with CdK. If it works for you, great. He reminds me of this other dude, who I can't remember the name of, who used to be around here, too. A French guy who wrote a lot of books, like Riding into the Light or something, never actually showed or really trained, talked a lot, and did a lot of "cool" clinics and advertising. There are people who are good promoters of themselves, and there are experts. you can take whatever you want from whomever you want.

[musical comedy]

He reminds me of this other dude, who I can't remember the name of, who used to be around here, too. A French guy who wrote a lot of books, like Riding into the Light or something, never actually showed or really trained, talked a lot, and did a lot of "cool" clinics and advertising. There are people who are good promoters of themselves, and there are experts. you can take whatever you want from whomever you want.

It was Belasik that wrote Riding Toward The Light. He's not French. You may be thinking of Domique Barbier? There are so many of those in that circle and they all do share some things in common.

[musical comedy]

Regarding DeKunffy's background after arriving in the USA. This, from the USDF website. Looks like he more or less put up his trainer shingle based on the experience he had a young boy back in Hungary.

Charles came to New York in 1957, graduating from Berkley in 1962. His first career in the US was from 1963 to 1976, as a school teacher, teaching philosophy and psychology in EastBay, outside of San Francisco. In those days, dressage in America was still very much in its infancy.

According to Charles, "I was more or less drafted into dressage in the US". Horseback riding in America was different from what he was used to seeing in Europe. He began helping some students in the EastBay and it grew from there.

He took a year off from teaching to judge and teach dressage. He then asked for a second year off from teaching. After his two year sabbatical, he decided to leave teaching altogether and focus on teaching dressage and judging.

From those early years, his involvement grew very quickly.

[Tanga]

[/quote] It was Belasik that wrote Riding Toward The Light. He's not French. You may be thinking of Domique Barbier? There are so many of those in that circle and they all do share some things in common.[/quote]

Yes! That's it! Barbier! I ended up getting a mare from someone who had rescued her from him. She had DENTS in the bars of her mouth. The dentist said he had never seen that before. She was terrified to take any actual contact to the bit and would flip over backwards if you pushed it. Goodness knows what he did to her to make that happen.

And that is my understanding of CdK's background.

[Josette]

https://www.horsemagazine.com/thm/whos- ... y-charles/

I've viewed two clinics many years ago with CdK and there is NO comparing him to Belasik or whoever Barbier is. He greatly helped each rider during their lesson while the audience and rider could see and feel the improvement. He also hopped on and rode a student's horse during their lesson to better demonstrate what he was trying to get through to the student.

[Ryeissa]

.

[Chisamba]

It is easy to be critical, but...I agree, Belasik is not a "nice" person. Belasik produces riders from people who look like Dresseur and Andrea, slender types with beautiful riding proportions. If you are curvy, or God forbid, plump, he is quite nasty, in the same way that George Morris thought it was amusing to be nasty. They can both develop riders though.

I did ride in a CdK clinic. Most of the horses and riders did well the first day, and most horses had sore backs the second. Now those who loved him said they were sore because they used their backs correctly for the first time, but my viewpoint was different.

Barbieri, pony tail and big moustache, lol. Double bridle on green horses, omg I shall take a photo of the bits he put in the mouth if Bally. Anyway, supposedly a Nuno Olivera methodology.

I had a working student from Europe fir a year who worked with Nuno, and the two differ a lot, so I'm not sure which of the two were really using Nuno methods.

My (legendary in my own eyes) quest for a clinician I can love led me to work with quite a few people. I don't recommend it, pick someone and stick with them is a better route.

Just like how your leg sits in the stirrup, what one person uses well doesn't apply to every one.

[Ryeissa]

It is easy to be critical, but...I agree, Belasik is not a "nice" person. Belasik produces riders from people who look like Dresseur and Andrea, slender types with beautiful riding proportions. If you are curvy, or God forbid, plump, he is quite nasty, in the same way that George Morris thought it was amusing to be nasty. They can both develop riders though.
.

that wasn't the problem in my case. he has a huge ego....when I met with him/saw him he never commented on the riders weight or such things.

[Dresseur]

He normally doesn't at clinics - unless he's in a bad mood. And now, he wouldn't dream of burning any bridges because they need the money. But unfiltered, yes, there is a bias towards horses and riders. It's how I ended up switching from Paul to Andrea in the first place, 1, he didn't want to work with the horses I had access too (difficult and not ultra fancy) and then 2, around the time he started the affair with Rose, he stopped trying in the lessons - I was a very, very loyal student and he just didn't pay any attention to the lessons any more, stopped early, and was generally disinterested.

In hindsight, he clearly had a lot on his mind, and during the "last straw" lesson, I was riding Calvin, a saint of a horse who is still going strong at 23-24?, and he was regularly schooled by the interns. Rose leaves a very specific, stuck feeling in horses (she's taught more horses to rear than I think is acceptable - hell, she got Kara to rear and that horse was lazy af, totally ammy safe). In any case, I could always tell whether her or Ryan had ridden him. On this particular day, Calvin was incredibly stuck and incredibly rein-lame. Usually I could ride him out of it shortly, but this time, it was a no-go. Paul got more and more frustrated and I finally said something along the lines of, "usually after Rose rides I can get him to feel good, but this time, I just can't seem to get him unlocked". Paul got furious, bitched about my riding, told me I sucked, pulled me off and then proceeded to ride the poor damn horse into an anxious lather, slamming him into trot/halt transitions and whipping and spurring him forward and then riding huge extensions, but he couldn't fix the rein-lameness in that ride. He then called a halt to the lesson about 20 minutes early (at $130/45mins - unacceptable). That was the last lesson I had with him. I found out later that all the interns got pulled off Calvin and it took Andrea a solid 3 rides to unlock him. Personally, I think he got so pissed at me because I was inadvertently criticizing his side-piece. And yes, I'm bitter, I loved PaR and I hated seeing the tradition and basic tenets of classical riding/training get torn down in front of my eyes in an effort to legitimize someone who talked the talk, but can't deliver on the riding and training. On the flip side, I benefited greatly by being in the right place at the right time, Andrea needed a person and I got riding, showing and learning opportunities that I would never have gotten otherwise - so it's a mixed bag of bitterness

Back to the thread though...for hunter/jumper, I was taught stirrup from the ball of the big toe to the outside of the last pinkie toe joint. For dressage, I do more straight across the ball of the foot, but I don't really use the stirrups, I keep a slight tension in the leg (picking the toe up) so that if the stirrup were to slip off, it would bounce back on all by itself.

[Tanga]

This thread and other things in life have prompted some ideas that I have been talking about and that musical comedy brought up.

If you are at a certain stage in riding beyond beginner, you don't need a lot of specialized help. You just need someone who can tell you what they see. I find that is my biggest issue. When I look at videos of myself, I rip myself apart and can tell me what I need to do. I don't have mirrors, and I can't see that on my own. Most people who can ride can give me enough feedback that is quite useful, even if they don't ride at the level I do. We all know there mostly isn't any secret to anything. People explain and teach things in different ways, but it's all the same idea. You don't have to have ridden or trained it to give viable feedback that can help anyone.

I think the only time you really need that someone with the extra knowledge is when you are trying to get something new you don't know how to do or train, and need some instructions. Like, teach the pirouette by spiraling in and out in a haunches in, or canter on the spot to extended canter, or whatever. And when something is going on that you can't fix because you can't see yourself. So, maybe you're not getting the half pass you want because even though you think you are sitting where you need to be, your weight is in the opposite direction and hindering the horse, or that little bend you have in the neck is way too much, and just keeping them straighter makes all of the difference.

This is not in response to anything in particular, but just some ideas.

[PhoenixRising]

I haven't followed up too much with this topic yet, since I haven't been riding. But my new saddle is ordered and I'm really excited to see how that changes things. I'll be interested to see how my leg and foot position changes in the new saddle when it comes. I think I'll be capable of more stability, which I struggle with. Riding a lot of youngsters over the years has taught me to be loose, not stable.

The saddle I was using at the time of this post really made getting my leg in position difficult. It puts everyone who sits in it into a chair seat. I fought and fought to keep my leg back and just couldn't.

[Linden]

I find it’s easier to show where my foot sits on the stirrup than to describe it. Interesting discussion!