Horse shopping, how did you know what you want?

[Lipsmackerpony88]

Straightforward, it sounds like a cool cross! Hopefully I get to try him tomorrow, if nothing else just try that type out...

I know the right one will pop up eventually! I'm trying as many as I can though because I think it helps me narrow down what I want even more. I do try only horses that I think might work but some do take an open mind.

[Lipsmackerpony88]

Actually I'm try to pause my search and focus on taking lessons and getting my A game on again but it's so hard not to look at a potential prospect ha ha!

[StraightForward]

Oh yeah, owners! About 5 years ago I found on Craigslist a 4 or 5 year old 16.1 APHA gelding in a small Oregon town about 5 hours from here. There were some video snippets and he had a lovely, elastic walk. The owner emailed me back with this long diatribe about her horse life, losing the stallion this horse was by to a cougar attack, and a bunch of other stuff. My husband read it and said: "that is a crazy person." Undeterred, I dragged husband and my dad, who happened to be visiting, halfway across Oregon to look at this horse. The owner had a holstered pistol when she met us in the drive and explained about the cougars. She only had a roundpen, so I get on the horse, my first time in a western saddle in probably 5 years, walk and trot around, then she hops on another horse and we go for a little ride down the road, through a thicket of trees with a culvert rushing water under the road, which she declares that he has never been past before. Horse was a champ, we rode back, she showed me how well he loaded, and we talked for a bit and I said I'd like to set up a PPE. Of course, there is only one horse vet in this isolated town, so I'm stuck having her vet do the PPE, and I let her know that I want my vet to review the radiographs, which she says is fine. Her vet says horse is ouchy on gravel, but otherwise sound, and rads look good. He says due to the mountainous, rocky terrain, older horses in that area get ringbone. My vet calls me down to his office and says he thinks maybe there is something that could be the start of ringbone, but the radiograph quality is crap, so it's hard to say. Wow did they get pissed when I called and said I can't buy him based on my vet's feedback, but if they wanted to redo the radiographs and they were clean I would reconsider. They sent the rads for a third opinion, then the owner's trainer friend, who I've never met, sent me a like 3-page email saying that I was making stuff up so I could back out of the sale because I was afraid of the horse (who wouldn't look tense on a green unfamiliar horse in a saddle they're not used to, riding the horse through a scary spot he's never passed? An idiot, that's who), she could tell I was not emotionally ready to buy a new horse and how dare I question the sterling opinion of their esteemed vet.

Should have listened to my husband about that first email!

[Lipsmackerpony88]

Straightforward oh my gosh. Yep, your husband called it!! I've definitely had similar situations. I think we all have some stories to tell, one day I think I'll write a book people are insane. Especially in the horse
world. It can be entertaining when you aren't in the thick of it!

[exvet]

I am another who has experienced some absolutely saintly and talented quarabs in my past. One was a golden haired gal exactly 14.2. She was awesome on cross country. Most were shocked to find out her short stature because she was like a 'total monster' when it came to attacking a course - safe but very, very game. She was a complete blast. I hate horse buying and horse selling for the very 'typical' stuff you're going through and as said most of us have experienced. It's emotional no matter how yous slice it. Yet, when you do finally find 'the one' it turns out to be so worth it. I also have found that when you back off on the search, sometimes THAT is when you find the perfect one and often it's been in your own backyard all this time. It's how I ended up with my horse of a lifetime, my Arab gelding who helped me earn my bronze after several challenging years together. He was a true family horse and never put a foot wrong. The challenges were all about me learning dressage on an overachiever who would turn himself inside out to give me what I thought I wanted. I almost passed on him (actually I did twice) but kept coming back after every other horse I looked at because we just clicked. I had in my head the Ayerab stigma and fortunately for me I got over myself enough to go on and enjoy many wonderful adventures, now memories, with a horse that was a true companion. I had to open up my mind to allow myself to go the unconventional direction at a time when EVERYONE was telling me to stick with my holsteiners...........................glad I listened to my heart and continue to do so.

[Lipsmackerpony88]

Exvet, oh yes definitely! The market is so high and dry here right now that I honestly expect it to be tough. So I find it more amusing but I did cry once. I just clicked so much with my Wobblers horse, it is hard to be shopping again only a year later. I do sometimes feel kind of desperate like oh my gosh am I ever going to find a horse?! But it's not been that long of a search!

I am backing off but not completely. Just seeing what pops up. There was actually quite a few horses in Virginia and in Florida that I was pretty interested in. But with the current covid numbers and the holidays I don't feel good about traveling. It is what it is.

Hearing from you and so many others that have had such success on many different types and breeds helps me open my mind a little. Besides I do like meeting and trying different types. Each horse is so different.

[Lipsmackerpony88]

Well the horse today was by far the worst. Rude behavior on the ground (like swingingg his butt into the trainer.) Bolted when we entered the arena (TWICE .)
She immediately put him on the lunge into a canter. Not at all how I would approach it.

Then she gets on him. She tells me to stand by the mounting block so I don't get run over. Um, okay. So I do. The horse just starts running around, throwing his shoulder everywhere. It was like watching a barrel racer right before they go in the gate. Very little control. I almost got ran over about 4 or 5 times. She's just trying to do little circles while the horse is throwing himself around. I told her that I didn't need to ride, he wasn't a fit for me.

So bizarre. He was advertised as a training level Dressage horse. You have to have control for that...

[Moutaineer]

Oh, dear. There are some crazy deluded people out there.

(Remembering the day my vet was doing a PPE for me on a horse that I felt sorry for, and he took me to one side and quietly told me to politely decline and then run like hell for my car, and he'd meet me down the street to tell me his conclusions...)

[blob]

Yikes, no good.


As for the chestnut mare. I have not found the adding weight adds bad/hot energy. Most horses the are very under weight are not comfortable and some are actually more anxious at that stage than once they have weight on.

RP was very under weight when I got him. You could see good his whole spine clearly. He finally has the weight I'd want on him and that has correlated with his behavior as well.

[Lipsmackerpony88]

Mountaineer, oh gosh. Thank goodness for our vets that have our backs. My vet has definitely given me "the look" before. Lol!!

Blob, interesting! I'll probably pass on this girl because I think she will be pretty marish and really is so thin she needs the winter off to gain weight (plus she's very young.) Her manners on the ground were pretty awful too. Fixable but I think she falls into the project catagory a little too much for me right now. I feel like my heart and pocketbook have been dragged through the mud after losing two horses. I just want the best chances I can have for a healthy horse and to ride.

[Lipsmackerpony88]

I am learning that I'm a stickler for ground manners-many people seem like that can't be bothered with it. It blows my mind.

[blob]

I am learning that I'm a stickler for ground manners-many people seem like that can't be bothered with it. It blows my mind.

I am too. But it's something I am willing and able to teach myself. If I added that to my criteria, I'm not sure I would ever find a horse!

[Lipsmackerpony88]

Blob, yes of course! Just saying it's something that really irks me that I'm seeing a lot!

[demi]

How long are you going to back off for? I ask because I just visited my next door neighbor and he showed me his newest QH fillies. I totally fell in love with one, a chocolate palomino, named Fern. Neighbor is a very good horseman both riding (used to be a darn good saddle bronc rider) and breeding. He broke Fern’s dam who is now 16 and he said she was easy. He and a friend of his breed these horses together and between them they have broken, trained, and bred several generations of their ranch horse breeding stock. They are registered AQHA, too.

Fern’s dam has a nice conformation that looks like she could do dressage. Nice withers, nice shoulder, nice HQ and not built downhill. The babies were playing in the pasture and the momma got going enough so I could see her trot. Quite nice. But the best part is the temperament.

I am having to tell myself NO NO NO! I’m too old for babies....but you’re not

[Lipsmackerpony88]

Demi, chocolate palomino ohhhh! I'm only planning on backing off on the search a little bit while I take lessons and get back into riding shape / covid gets under control a bit. So hopefully only a few months. but if the right thing pops up I'm definitely going to still go look if it's local!

[StraightForward]

I just watched this webinar on C6/C7 vertebral malformation. It is depressing, but might give you some things to watch for and maybe rule out some horses without wasting PPE money: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Szk4oSp_Rd4&t=5163s

[Lipsmackerpony88]

Straightforward, I watched that a few days ago. Definitely depressing but eye opening. I'm hypersensitive to that stuff since I did buy a horse that had wobblers.

[khall]

SF very depressing. My holistic vet has diagnosed two I don’t know the breeds

[Lipsmackerpony88]

https://youtu.be/kXAf8kOUDFM I tried this guy yesterday. This is the sale video but I'll post more. He's off the track and feels like it (not as supple as I wish) but he definitely seemed like he had a work ethic. I didn't read him as well as the trainer. I was super sore from doing a jumping lesson lol and my position was crap! But he put up with me well. We even had some deer appear on the side of the arena and all he did was look no spook.

Thinking on him... Supposed to do a second ride soon.

[exvet]

He certainly seems pleasant enough and a horse with a good try. Looking forward to hearing more about him.

[StraightForward]

He is elegant and looks like he would develop nicely!

[khall]

Lipsmacker oooh I like him!! So pretty nice mover and looks like a great brain.

[Lipsmackerpony88]

Okay here is few a little clips of me on him. Just a little trot. My position is horrid. This is why I want lunge lessons. It didn't help that I was so sore from my "jumping" lesson on Thursday. I was feeling it! https://youtu.be/e77xNfOvA6E
https://youtu.be/RrJEOjDdUqE
He did catch a toe occasionally in the hind and sometimes felt tailfishy with his hindend on a turn. Whether this was just from being young green and off the track I don't know. You can see it on the second video at 1:11-1:14

But I think he's worth a second look. I'd like him a little more supple laterally and I think he could use a lot more groundwork, for what I saw on the lunge. But does seem like he's got a good mind. A worker bee type the anticipates a little bit for sure reminds me of my first off the track years ago.

[StraightForward]

It looks to me like he just lost balance a little bit when he caught a toe there. Probably needs more strength in his stifles, but the rest of the time he moves quite nicely, so I don't think that is anything ominous.

[Lipsmackerpony88]

Fingers crossed, Straight forward that you are right. It only happens in a turn, when he was kinda bulging with his shoulder a bit too. But I'd be vetting him heavier, if second ride goes well.

[Tanga]

Oooh. I like this one. He has the use of the hind end that is critical to me in showing that he can really carry and is sound. I don't know why you think you always look bad riding--I can tell just from the little I have seen what a good rider you are. And you are on a brand new horse!

Definitely worth a second look and a good possibility. OK to ask what they are asking for him?

[Lipsmackerpony88]

Tanga, I guess I just know where I've been in my riding, so it's frustrating to feel so weak or see my position issues pop again. I probably need to be patient. Lol it's hard. But thank you. I want to be the best rider I can be!

He's just under $7k. Typical price for around here, actually cheaper lol. But negotiable.

[Lipsmackerpony88]

I would probably do partial training with him or at least 2 lessons a week for a few months.

[Lipsmackerpony88]

My budget is $11-12k though. But I also would not be able to do as much pro training if I spend that full amount. I'm not seeing much in my area to look at in that price range though. :/ It's slim pickings!

[blob]

did you try any of the others that lady had for sale?

I think you look great on him and you both look quite comfortable for a first ride with each other--always a good sign. I wouldn't be too worried about a relatively freshly off the track TB feeling stiff laterally--that's to be expected, and will improve imo. And he does look like he has some good longitudinal suppleness already.

[Chisamba]

I always expect to dislike OTTBs, but I was pleasantly surprised by this one.

[khall]

I still like him with you on him. I see lots of potential for the pair. I like a good minded nice moving good brain TB. Love his dark bay color too

[piedmontfields]

I agree that you look very comfortable on him and he looks very genuine about work + trying to do his best---the best TB traits IMO (besides their canter). How do you feel about your size/leg on him? You are riding with a pretty short stirrup here, but I sense you are quite petite. Did you like how he felt to your body? That is something you just know sometimes.

[Lipsmackerpony88]

@blob, I tried one other but saw 3. I decided against the 3 year old who I liked personality wise. Because as you soundness was questionable and then I noticed he was walked off the track for horse last race.

I rode one but I don't think you saw video, named Grandpa. He had quite the head toss (with his trainer too). We definitely had really nice moments. But he had more if a "make me" personality, not my type!

I looked at the mare, she wasn't as impressive in person though. Pretty nervous and not as good balance as the gelding.

He definitely started to loosen up but definitely starts off braced on the right, through the rib cage. But got better. I would be really interested to see how he would do with some more groundwork.

[Lipsmackerpony88]

@piedmontfield, I agree, the work ethic and their canters are a plus!

As far as size, I'm 5'2" so definitely petite! I honestly didn't feel small or anything on him. Usually what stands out to be is their barrel size/shape. But I didn't feel awkward on him.

[Lipsmackerpony88]

I think I had a harder time in the saddle/being sore than anything to tdo with his size I think with a Dressage saddle and longer stirrup I won't look SO tiny.

[Tanga]

I think he is right in the area you are looking for! I like what the person on the video was saying about him. I think he has a great attitude and really good movement, and for the price you could get him for, you can get that extra training you want when you need it.

I'm excited about this one!

[Lipsmackerpony88]

More pros: he stood like a rock when we were grooming/tacking up (which is nice because I have a 9 year old daughter who would like to help groom occasionally.)

And after our ride he playing tug a war with a stick with his pasture mate, totally hilarious.

[khall]

Lipsmaker how old is this guy? One thing I know when looking at horses to buy that are already going especially with an OTTB there absolutely will need to be retraining. But what you are starting with right now is a pretty dang good base if you end up with him.

Fun!

[Lipsmackerpony88]

Khalil he's just turned 5 years old. I believe he just came off the track the summer of 2020. I agree there is a good base there for sure! Fingers crossed.

[demi]

I like him, too!! Good luck.

[heddylamar]

He's five?! He looks safe and sane. Can you ride him a few more times?

[Lipsmackerpony88]

@heddylamar yep! 5 as of January 1st since he's a TB! DOB us February 2016 so close enough!

Definitely good momded, considering the deer that appeared right next to the arena, didn't spook!
I'm going to see him again, he's not exactly super close though and the market is insanely hot so not sure how many more rides but at least one more.

[Lipsmackerpony88]

So I've had two friends say they didn't like his end, thought he looked weak or NQR. I will keep it in mind but still seeing him again.

Turns out that a friend of mine trained him for a bit on the track. She said his mind was super. She had been eyeing him for a Dressage horse herself (she does dressage as a hobby.) But the owner sent him to another trainer for a few more races. I bet she's a reason he's going pretty well under saddle, she probably hacked him and did basic dressage.

She did say to x-ray his ankles. She said he was never unsound with them but occasionally had filling in his ankles. They gave him down time because they do not believe in injecting and running a horse. She did say that the trainer before he got to her barn is a tough barn. Hard on their horses. So she's always known him to be sound but she did say definitely vet him to be sure.

It's so nice that I know someone who knows him very well.

[Flight]

That's handy knowing someone who knew him when he raced.

I'm not a TB person, I need something who's arse is wider than mine. But he does look nice.

[blob]

I would say that a horse stocking up when in the stall doesn't really worry me as long as turnout/riding gets rid of it.

I'll also say that if you ask enough people, you'll always get some people who think a horse is nqr. He's 5 and recently off the track, I suspect he's weak behind. If you like him, my advice would be to do a good vetting with x-rays. And use that to make the decision if there's anything going on beyond a young horse with a new rider figuring things out.

[Ryeissa]

I saw the hind end too but didn't want to be a negative nelly. Course I do massage professionally so this is just how I view things. That doesn't mean its a deal breaker, but if I was getting paid to assess the horse that is what I would discuss. I also lost a horse in late 2011 to a neurological problem so this is a very sensitive topic for me.

[Ponichiwa]

My eye looks lower at the hind end: not in love with his pasterns. But I honestly think it's worth a vet check, especially as it looks like he's got a good brain in him, which counts for so much in this sport.

[Lipsmackerpony88]

Blob, I took it to mean they thought he was developing osselets and to x-ray to make sure there was no chips or something else. I looked at multiple that day, so next time I'll have to look at his legs with extra scrutiny. But I agree that some minor be stocking up on a stall isn't a huge deal. I won't use a box stall though, horses out here either have a stall with a run or outside pen with a shed.

[Lipsmackerpony88]

Ryeissa, well it's not being negative since I pointed out the weird step behind lol! Do you have the same opinion on the sale video?

I'm sorry to hear you lost a horse to a neurological condition. It's so heartbreaking and nerve wracking.

I've pledged to x-ray the neck of anything. We don't have much EPM or Lyme here (practically doesn't exist.) So that's less of a concern unless I buy out of state.