What do expect/ want to get out of lessons?

[Lipsmackerpony88]

I know this is so different for everyone but what do you expect or want to get out of a lesson?

I always want to either learn something or at least feel like I was pushed and my skills stretched and improved on. While I don't like negative nancy type instructors, I do like to be challenged. I like to be brought right "to my edge." I like to continue to find areas to improve on. Or find new things to try. I love and appreciate eyes on my position.

Recently I had a lesson (and a few like this) where I leave thinking that while I enjoyed riding, did I improve much? Did I learn anything?
I'm leaving feeling empty. I'm wondering if my expectations are too high. Or if this is a sign.

[exvet]

Well after 5 decades of lessons, and though I don't think I trainer/instructor hop, I honestly can't count the number of trainers/instructors/coaches I've had over the years. There are a number of ones that I learned a lot from and very much appreciated what they were able to teach me. Most have the same overall style of teaching. I appreciate honest feedback and criticism. I don't want to hear 'good' if it's not but I do appreciate being told if I'm headed in the right direction, just not quite there yet. I also appreciate having it clearly explained to me what I need in order to get there and a plan on how to get there as well as the reality of what the best is going to look like for me and my mount (ie, if my horse is only ever going to be able to achieve an 8 on half-pass then fine). I want someone to tell me like it is and then tell me where to focus to maximize what I can. At the end of a lesson I want to feel like I progressed even if it's just a little and/or identified an area that needs more focus and was provided a plan on what to do in preparation for the next lesson in order to get closer to the goal. I do very much appreciate homework and tools (exercises especially). I know that not every lesson is going to end in a light bulb moment. I also know that not every ride is going to feel like nirvana; but, I do expect that an instructor is going to help end a lesson in such a way that the horse isn't left completely frustrated (nor I). I don't ride other people's horses in lessons; so, it's vitally important to me that my horse be a major focus of success/building confidence/progress no matter how big or small. I don't care if the instructor would ever recommend or want my horse; but, they must be respectful and willing to work with what I choose to ride no matter what.

I work best with instructors who are matter-of-fact, get right to the point, have multiple approaches (many tools) for getting things done with a variety of horse-types, and those who can ride through me - I'm mostly a visual and kinesthetic learner; so, if someone simply tells me more left leg, more from behind, weight your right seat bone and then tell me it looks right, I can reproduce it. That is not to say that I don't want someone to explain the reason behind an exercise or their reasoning for choosing such because that is what I want; but, I don't want to waste my 45 minutes on 35 minutes of theory. As you say though, this is different for everyone and my 'needs' have significantly changed over the years. I am not the same rider I was in my 20s - that is neither good nor bad; but, my priorities and expectations are definitely different.

[blob]

Ultimately I am a lazy rider. And so, I do well with instructors who push you hard. These method doesn't work for everyone, but it does work for me. It's also something I'm transparent about with instructors who don't necessarily default to this way of teaching, but are very capable of doing so.

I expect that something about my horse or my riding should improve during the course of a lesson. Doesn't mean i expect to come out with dramatic changes. But just say we are working on collected trot--i want the following: some improvement in our collected trot, and some tips/tools for continuing that improvement on my own time.

[Ryeissa]

Diagnose problems, find solution, integrate solutions to understand, have homework to fix the concerns.

[StraightForward]

I haven't had a ton of lessons in my life, but I've been very happy with the instructor I've been lessoning with for the past 3.5 years or so. Sometimes it's just basic stuff though. Prior to that I would occasionally take lessons with someone who had a really soft voice, and her CeeCoach died, so lessons turned into her telling me to go ride a figure, then I would have to come back and be told what I did wrong, and then go again. Needless it say it was not very effective, and the last two times I worked with her, she ran long on the lesson before me, made me run Annabelle off her feet, told me she needed to track up more, and that was about it.

Current instructor comes through 1-2x per month, so it is different than someone I see every week or being in a program with multiple lessons/training rides per week. No one but me has ever been on my horses either. I see that as more of a coaching situation where the instructor is going to be more involved in your day-to-day decisions about training schedules, shows, and even tack, shoeing and nutrition.

But anyway, on to the teaching style - she definitely pushes us both harder than I typically do on my own, and "rides through me." But she also explains more where she is going - i.e. "you need to develop this suppleness in her hind end, or this problem I was trying to iron out is going to help later with the flying changes" and she also gives me some pointers on schooling in between lessons. She also lets me think for myself, so she's happy if I decide to throw in some lateral work or an extra transition where I feel like the quality isn't there and I need to address the bend or energy or whatever. She is also great about giving positive feedback in the moment, which helps me because then I know what feeling to try to recapture later. I would say I do take something away from each lesson, as far as the new level to push towards and exercises to address problems. However, with this format I definitely have to be very self-directed and self-motivated, so I try to ride with an analytical approach in between lessons and use online courses to increase my knowledge base, which helps me get more out of lessons. I'm not sure how effective this setup would be without the homework I do off the horse.

The other thing, I think, is to use someone who understands and appreciates your kind of horse. My instructor rode stock horses earlier in her career, so she understands what A needs to be able to carry and free up her shoulders, and luckily she now has two young warmbloods, so she also understands how to deal with those shenanigans. I definitely would always want to work with someone who has brought along their own horses through the levels rather than someone who has taken on a pre-trained upper level horse and might not recognize or know how to address some of the basics while also not just getting stuck there, but keeping progression in minde.

[Moutaineer]

Such an "it depends" situation.

I think at the moment your lessons are on school horses, correct? In which case my desired outcome would be to see an improvement in my own skills--now I might not expect to see this in one lesson, as the teacher needs time to evaluate what you need help on (which might not be what you think you need help on,) but over the course of a series of lessons--say 4 or more, I wouldn't want to come out thinking "well that was a nice little ride, but I didn't improve at anything." So I think you have to stick with one teacher for a few sessions, unless they are obviously a mismatch/not up to your own skillset.

Now that same instructor might not be the one I want to teach me on my own horse. Still an "it depends" though.

I've spent big bucks on clinics with top trainers and felt after 2 days that they've taken my money and taught me nothing, and because I'm not wealthy/talented/young, they thought it was OK to just phone it in and I'd be grateful for their mere presence--or maybe they just didn't have the particular skills required to teach middle-aged amateurs on ordinary horses. (Young, talented women are the worst offenders at this. I've learned now--ride with mature women--they understand much more about the aging body and brain )

[Ponichiwa]

Not every lesson is a breakthrough for me, but I do try to get stretched outside of my (and my horse's) comfort zone in each lesson. Not looking to be overloaded, but if we're not pushing a bit more past what I do on my own, I'm not really improving.

I've spent big bucks on clinics with top trainers and felt after 2 days that they've taken my money and taught me nothing, and because I'm not wealthy/talented/young, they thought it was OK to just phone it in and I'd be grateful for their mere presence--or maybe they just didn't have the particular skills required to teach middle-aged amateurs on ordinary horses. (Young, talented women are the worst offenders at this. I've learned now--ride with mature women--they understand much more about the aging body and brain )

I've had exactly this ride before. Expensive way to learn who to ride with and who to avoid (and I would have come to a different conclusion if I'd only audited, I think).

[Lipsmackerpony88]

Thanks guys! I am still taking lessons on school horses right now although I did have an in hand session with my guy last week. And we'll be having a dressage lesson on him and hopefully the 27th.

I'm riding with three people right now. I know that seems crazy to some people but in the past that has worked really well for me. I typically think that I have a pretty clear view about the path I need to go on I just need people to support me on that path. So I'm pretty good about picking instructors that have similar theory. Sometimes they will vary and their style of teaching which I personally think can be helpful.

I'm taking jumping lessons, love the instructors style. She pushes me every lesson but also tells me when I'm on the right track. We are always doing new things.

Then I have a silver medalist that is coming to the barn to work with my horse. Her schedule is very limited and she can only come out probably once or twice a month. I have only ridden with her briefly but so far I really enjoy her. She is down to earth but just seems very correct and always leaves me with homework. Sometimes I wish she was just a bit tougher on me but I feel like she gives me a good direction and I feel like there's always improvement and lots of different exercises. Of course right now I'm just getting going with her and my new horse.

And I'm taking lessons with a bronze medalist on a school horse. It has been intermittent because of different issues unfortunately not in my control. I think yesterday was my 4th or 5th lesson. It was going to be a low-key lesson as far as impact. Which I'm totally fine with I'm of the school thought that even if you have a lesson completely and walk there's plenty of things to do!!

When I left I was trying to think of if I improved on anything or if I had any homework. I really don't know... I was told my position was good The only nitpick was to turn my shoulder a little bit on a circle. And that some of my leg yields towards the end of the lesson were much more straighter and good towards the end. And I was told once during a transition to ride him more uphill.

That's it. And the whole time there's multiple people coming up and talking to the instructor. This happens every time. I think it's really rude for people to be talking to an instructor in the middle of a lesson...

I think I tend to like more challenging to it like it is types. I like to feel a little bit exhausted after lesson. Maybe not necessarily physically but that it pushed me! Or that I at least have a clear path of things to work on and where we are going.

[Lipsmackerpony88]

I've been lucky, so far every clinic I've ever ridden in has been awesome. I always feel like I was pushed. And I try to ride with people that only fit into the same type of theory that I'm following.

I like people to be positive so that I know what's correct or not. But if I'm not improving or being pushed I don't really see a point. Being told I'm good doesn't do it for me. Because my standards are higher and I know I'm not there yet!!

[MsM]

I remember lessons - vaguely! Since my instructor moved out of state (and then Covid) it has been a struggle to get a lesson. My last was in November, and my next will be in June! It is tough when you do not have a dressage instructor at your boarding barn. And being pretty much the only dressage rider, I have had no luck getting someone else to come to the barn. (I don't have a truck/trailer)

I always want homework - even when I got regular lessons. This instructor is fairly "soft" but I know her and know how to push her to get the most out of my lessons. I have learned to tell people to speak up and tell what you are feeling and ask questions since the time a hunter rider took a lesson and didnt get much out because she rode like a show hack to hide problems and never opened her mouth! (Her regular instructor did NOT like students to talk - shut up and ride!)

I rode with a harsher instructor some years ago. Her comments could be biting but they were on point, helpful, and usually funny! My mom watched a lesson and commented "I don't think I yelled at you that much the whole time you were growing up!" I improved a lot from her instruction and we had a lot of laughs.

The worst instructors were the "hmmm, good. Track left..." disinterested ones. I clinicked with a couple that I don't think were interested in average me and my average horse. Once, I think she just didn't know how to help a non-WB. The other I think was only interested in the high dollar clients and shortchanged my lesson. They never got my money again.

So I expect to get the instructors attention and help for the allotted time at the bare minimum. I want to get clearer picture of where the horse and I are and a bit of a roadmap to improve.

[Kelo1]

I want the instructor to evaluate where we are in that moment (there are days where me and my horse are on fire, and days where we're a little more remedial) and we work to improve where we are. That means having exercises and learning the feel of the improvement that I can work on between lessons. Most commonly we work on the basics and individual movements (several during the period of the lesson). It's pretty rare we string movements together ie a test.

I prefer to just work without a lot of back-and-forth chatting, and keep my comments limited only to questions (maybe some chatting during walk breaks if we're not talking about what we're learning). I'm warmed up and ready to go when my lesson starts, and I want to work til the end of the lesson or til I am satisfied with the day, whichever comes first (it's not unheard of where if I have an hour lesson, we quit at 45 min because of good progress.)

I know it can be hard, I've had instructors just run out of tools in their toolbox to help me, which is simply a reflection of the challenge that is me, not them. Everyone has different experiences with different people (learning styles) and horses (abilities and challenges) so a tool that helped you might not click with me. For example I had an instructor who was amazing at first but eventually started kinda phoning it in during my lessons. Like, we were in a rut where we were just doing the same stuff, she was saying the same things (mostly about my position). Plus I could literally hear her texting over the speaker while teaching me (ie her phone was making the typing noises), repeatedly and often. It is so difficult for me to afford the lessons that after a few rounds of that (hoping we were jut having an off day), I got the picture and found a new instructor.

[StraightForward]

Another kind of unquantifiable thing I thought of is whether you ride better or worse in front of your instructor. With my previous instructor, I would feel like I was doing well, and be excited to get a lesson (they tended to be months apart) to show progress and get ideas for the next step. Then the lesson would happen and I would ride like crap and everything would fall apart like we'd regressed by two months. Now it's the opposite for whatever reason. I'm almost always riding my best in lessons, so then I know what I'm capable of and can bring that back into my everyday training. I think it's just a matter of personalities meshing well and getting the right mixture of constructive criticism and encouragement.

[Lipsmackerpony88]

Kelo1, I think your last paragraph summed up how I was feeling. Doing the same stuff and instructor was distracted. It really hasn't been long enough for that.

Last lesson was better. I was pretty direct though and asked if we could potentially work on certain things that I know I need to work on.


SF, I've had similar things happen! Usually if an instructor is micromanaging too much, my body gets all weird.

[khall]

At this point in my riding nuggets of information to add to my notebook

[exvet]

You know I used to hate to be micromanaged. There are still times that I will have to tune out my instructor and ride the horse under me to a point where I can reorganize and then feel like I have something to work with and 'start over' during a lesson. Yet one thing I have found with my current instructor (and friend) is that her 'micromanaging' while I'm riding is really exactly what I need. I'm a very 'seat of the pants' type of rider. I've ridden for so long that by now many of my reactions are automatic and most of the time 'right' BUT there are so many little things that need correcting and as she says, "just a hair'. These are the things I don't feel because of my focus [on the horse] within the moment. For example, I need her to call out to me while I'm trying to capture the right shoulder to put a little more weight in my right stirrup or raise my right hand 'a hair', etc or rider for the 'slight feel' of renver for one stride. At times it can seem like she's an automatic weapon firing out commands for my body to follow in rapid fire succession but I have found that it really is what I need to improve my timing because I am always 'a hair' late. If I just listen and feel, I'm finding my timing is improving and more importantly that improved timing is starting to happen when I'm riding alone.

[Lipsmackerpony88]

Exvet, interesting! I am a very visual learner. So if I'm told too many things at once but I don't see the big picture of what we are going for, I basically just start doing Really weird things with my body.

I overthink things sometimes which doesn't help

[exvet]

Exvet, interesting! I am a very visual learner. So if I'm told too many things at once but I don't see the big picture of what we are going for, I basically just start doing Really weird things with my body.

I overthink things sometimes which doesn't help

Yeah I have had the same problem especially when I first came back to dressage as an adult. I felt like so many of the instructors and clinicians I rode with wanted to discuss butterflies and puppy dog tails all day long while I was paying them. Truly many were accomplished, capable and well-meaning; but, I really wanted and needed to just ride and be told how to do it. I appreciated the theory but I'd rather read about it and then ask questions as to how to practically apply it. I too am a visual learner to a degree (been tested for a photographic memory) but for me to be really effective I have to go through the motions (correctly and accurately). The best way for me to learn is to see one, do one and teach one.......then I never forget. While I will never, ever regret growing up on horseback and learning how to ride by the seat of my pants the one disadvantage I believe is you don't always know or understand why something might work, it just does...........but..........theory is necessary, understanding how things fit into the bigger picture is necessary and that I've come to learn over many years of trial and error. Now that I'm older and unfortunately more broken down physically I have the maturity, more patience and of course experience to really be able to effectively apply things (as well as analyze things correctly in order to understand how to tweak them effectively) but then there's the rub.....I do have concerns that my body will give out before I reach my goals. To be completely honest that is why I've ridden the number of horses I have, why I'm driven to keep multiple horses in my barn and try to take advantage of as many learning opportunities as I can, sometimes rushing things, sometimes not. That rapid fire instruction is forcing me to raise my own bar which I need to do before it's too late.

[Lipsmackerpony88]

Yes exactly. I can't handle the too flowery types or too metaphors. Sometimes I just need someone to tell me Hey put your right shoulder back. Not all kinds of different metaphors to tell me to basically put my shoulder back. I did ride with the lady once that wanted to get really into anatomy and would talk about different parts of muscles or bones. Way to technical for me to think about while trying to ride... Again just tell me to put my leg back or something!

I think a lot of it does come down to personality too. I think I am a bit fearful of whether I actually can do this or not. So while on one hand I can be very driven, I can also get in a comfort zone and kind of like to stay there too. I need someone that can kind of see that and will know when to push me. I always joke that I should have been a hunter rider. And I don't mean that saying that right in the hunters is easy. Just that that kind of rhythm relaxation and pace just comes naturally to me. I have to work really hard to power up for dressage! Getting horses relaxed is a piece of cake for me which in itself isn't a bad thing I guess but I need to be able to add on to that.

[Chisamba]

First, respect my horse. idgaf if you usually teach million dollar clients and warmbloods, if you cannot help me and my horse why are you taking my money. ( sometimes it's arrogance, and sometimes it's inability but not every clinician can help certain types of horses)

I need a good eye on the ground. a clinician who can see and address my specific horse and needs. I do not need someone spouting textbooks or quoting odg with little to no recognition of application of aids or improvements of horse. " your topline seems good but the under neck is braced. ( for example)

useful terminology. don't tell me " keep the white stripe vertical " what white stripe? or don't hold,, fluff the rein. ( advice given to a rider on a bolting horse) . don't tell me to slow the rhythm for example .

then of course I want to feel improvement and a path open forward. ( homework)

[khall]

I think I’m pretty adaptable to different instructors and instruction. I can listen and appply and make changes. At this point I don’t need theory but more seat in the saddle on a variety of horses. I would not tolerate abuse to myself or my horse but am open to listening and trying to apply what they tell me.

Riding in Spain and Portugal gave me opportunities to try horses trained by others and their methodology. Learn form both
horses and instructors.

Right now my biggest hang up is my seat and trying to improve it. Always a work in progress

[heddylamar]

I need clear feedback. If a metaphor isn't working, don't keep harping on the same damn thing, find another way to explain what you're asking me to do. And do not ever yell. I will walk out.

Other than that? I need homework. I'm not someone who rides with my trainer weekly — it's just not possible with my work schedule. So give me homework.

When I came back for my second session with the current trainer, she was astounded at the progress we'd made in three weeks. It was all thanks to her — she'd pointed out a few things I needed to work on for myself, then things I needed to work on with Maia. Rather than do it all at once, I jotted it all down, then worked through it step by step until all the pieces came together. And, then, since I've worked with young horses a time or two, I was able to build on that.