Help needed with work issue.

User avatar
Saddlebum
Herd Member
Posts: 218
Joined: Sun Oct 18, 2015 12:28 pm
Location: NW Lower Michigan

Help needed with work issue.

Postby Saddlebum » Sat Dec 16, 2017 11:33 pm

I'm a new employee and my boss is a new supervisor over 8 or 12 employees. I'm 64, she's 26, grin. She started here when she was 19 and only a H.S. education. No one inside applied for this management position but her and one outside person. She has worked her way up from clerical to outside worker and now to this position. She has no other education but on the job.

She opens my mail and it bothers me. Twice now, she has given me my mail already opened and told me the contents, today, she took the contents out in front of me and started to unfold and read it. It is from the company and addressed only to me.

I want to say something to her but only if I know she is not supposed to be doing this. Seems wrong to me.

What do you all think?

Amado
Herd Member
Posts: 283
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2015 12:02 am
Location: The richest hill on earth.
Contact:

Re: Help needed with work issue.

Postby Amado » Sat Dec 16, 2017 11:36 pm

Seems wrong to me. No matter what her educational background is, or how old she is. It would bother me.

kande50
Bringing Life to the DDBB
Posts: 1781
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2015 7:28 pm
Location: Williamstown, MA

Re: Help needed with work issue.

Postby kande50 » Sat Dec 16, 2017 11:38 pm

I'd say she doesn't know and you should let her know.

I think if I'd made the mistake of opening someone's (anyone's) mail at work they'd have looked at me and said something like, "You aren't opening my mail, are you"?

PaulaO
Bringing Life to the DDBB
Posts: 2174
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2015 4:16 pm
Location: Northern Illinois

Re: Help needed with work issue.

Postby PaulaO » Sun Dec 17, 2017 1:32 am

Go to Human Resources. This person is way out of bounds

User avatar
Saddlebum
Herd Member
Posts: 218
Joined: Sun Oct 18, 2015 12:28 pm
Location: NW Lower Michigan

Re: Help needed with work issue.

Postby Saddlebum » Sun Dec 17, 2017 2:06 am

It wasn't a mistake on her part. I'm not one to confront anyone face to face. Not quick witted, very slow thinker. So I have always step away and think of how to say it, what to say and when/where before speaking.

Because she's my boss and so young and inexperienced, I think PaulaO is correct. Thanks!

Koolkat
500 post plus club
Posts: 691
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2015 2:15 am
Location: Cascade foothills

Re: Help needed with work issue.

Postby Koolkat » Sun Dec 17, 2017 2:55 am

You can be very open ended/non judgmental about it when you talk to HR - just tell what is going on, it is making you uncomfortable, should it, is it appropriate, and what should you (or they) do about it. I would play it very low key. The power dynamics of work can suck at times.

Be smarter. . . ;)

Literiding
Herd Member
Posts: 149
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2015 7:53 pm

Re: Help needed with work issue.

Postby Literiding » Sun Dec 17, 2017 3:06 am

Be careful!!!!!

As a long time executive, we need to distinguish between bad management and unlawful. Anything addressed to you in your capacity as an employee regarding company business actually belongs to the company and is not considered legally as your personal mail. The company is perfectly within it's rights to open your company mail in your absence in order to conduct it's operations. For example, if you went on cruise, and failed to assign someone to handle your correspondence, the company could assign someone else without your consent to preform your functions. Likewise, it took me quite a while not to be irritated by having every draft of out going correspondence having to be reviewed by every supervisor between myself and the person in charge. Again, the outgoing correspondence is the business of the company and is subject to any rules regarding review the company cares to impose.

It is said most small and medium sized businesses survive in spite of themselves. Your problem is a classic case of poor personal management practices. An employee should be allowed to complete their duties without interference unless there are deficiencies in performance. If so, there is a protocol of counseling, letters of instruction, etc. In extreme cases, assigning someone else to handle the correspondence is permitted. Opening the company mail addressed to you in this circumstance isn't good personnel management, yes, irritating but not unlawful. Written policies and procedures are usually the only way to address these sort of issues and if there aren't any, that says something about the company.

Edited to add:

The supervisor is for most purposes considered, "THE COMPANY" unless the company has a policy and procedures manual of some sort. Policy and procedures limit the authority of the supervisors and provides the means for employees to complain and get redress from arbitrary supervisors. Otherwise, it's one on one with the supervisor and if significant enough, may involve the next level of management. Usually in cases of employee verses supervisor, the management always sides with the supervisor as a matter of expediency unless the supervisor is doing something unlawful under employment law -- assuming that the manager is well enough trained to know what is legal and what is not. Not always a valid assumption in small companies.

User avatar
StraightForward
Bringing Life to the DDBB
Posts: 3102
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2015 3:04 pm
Location: Idaho

Re: Help needed with work issue.

Postby StraightForward » Sun Dec 17, 2017 4:13 am

I agree with LiteRiding. It depends upon the nature of the mail. If it has to do with your private personnel information (say a retirement benefit statement or healthcare info), I think it's wrong of her to open it, and I would say something. However, if it's pertaining to the business, and does not contain your confidential information, I wouldn't worry about it. I work in a larger office with a mailroom, and it's routine for certain things to be opened in the mailroom (certified mail, some packages) regardless of who's name is on the label.
Keep calm and canter on.

Koolkat
500 post plus club
Posts: 691
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2015 2:15 am
Location: Cascade foothills

Re: Help needed with work issue.

Postby Koolkat » Sun Dec 17, 2017 7:12 am

Saddlebum wrote: today, she took the contents out in front of me and started to unfold and read it. It is from the company and addressed only to me.

User avatar
Saddlebum
Herd Member
Posts: 218
Joined: Sun Oct 18, 2015 12:28 pm
Location: NW Lower Michigan

Re: Help needed with work issue.

Postby Saddlebum » Sun Dec 17, 2017 11:39 am

Literiding, I looked up on google search an employers right to open mail. Still not sure in this case because it was originally addressed to me at my street address. I have a P.O. box and do not receive mail at my street address. Therefore, the checks which were reimbursement for co. expenses were returned to the company as not deliverable as addressed (this was the same for both instances of her opening my mail). The company forwarded it to my boss who opened it and then passed it along to me.

I was going to call Human Resources but have decided not to pursue it. There won't be any more mail sent to me at the work place as I have changed my mailing address through my employee profile.

Irritates me because I know I signed paperwork which stated my mailing address different from my street address. As I also know I signed paperwork opting out of their retirement plan. They have been taking out of my pay check for the retirement plan and I called, received the paperwork to stop and opt out.

This is a "VERY BIG" company and they use a subcontractor for payroll. Even tho I have gone in and changed my mailing address on the employee profile page, this subcontractor does not have access to it but they were willing to mail the paperwork for the opting out change to my P.O. Box. Which I received and returned.

She has bragged to her friends who she worked with on an equal basis and also in front of another new employee in her office at work that she does not like a certain person (she named him) and she makes sure to assign him to a duty she knows he hates doing. Excuse me, just venting. She is too inexperienced and lacks character. I'm new and expect to get the nasty jobs.

Needless to say, I will be leaving asap.

Literiding
Herd Member
Posts: 149
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2015 7:53 pm

Re: Help needed with work issue.

Postby Literiding » Sun Dec 17, 2017 12:26 pm

Saddlebum wrote:Literiding, I looked up on google search an employers right to open mail. Still not sure in this case because it was originally addressed to me at my street address. I have a P.O. box and do not receive mail at my street address. Therefore, the checks which were reimbursement for co. expenses were returned to the company as not deliverable as addressed (this was the same for both instances of her opening my mail). The company forwarded it to my boss who opened it and then passed it along to me.


Ok, with the additional information, your supervisor DID do something unlawful. Messing with he U.S. Postal system is a violation of Federal Law and you would have a reason to go to a U.S. Postal inspector. The letter was addressed to you via the U.S. Postal system and involved private information. That the letter was returned as undeliverable didn't change it's status. Given that the check was prepared by a contractor means the undeliverable personal letter should have been returned to H.R. person or office responsible for expense pay and it should have been hand delivered to you. A letter entrusted to the U.S. Postal System may be opened only by the sender or recipient (a "Dead Letter" clerk may open it under the authority of trying to deliver a letter). Also, most private companies are extremely sensitive to pay amount being shared amoung other employees. If the circumstances of this letter were investigated, I would expect that the H.R. department forwarded your expense check via internal mail with the expectation that your supervisor would not open it.

Needless to say, I will be leaving asap.


Probably a good plan. I would suggest that you might want to document this as one of the reasons you are resigning in your resignation letter. Also, stating that you personally heard the supervisor discriminating against a fellow employee by assigning them disliked tasks exclusively creating in your mind a "hostile" work environment. May not do any good, but in to day's super politically correct work place, it may cause an investigation or at least cause the supervisor to be more closely monitored. In the smaller businesses, it would be a futile effort but it has some chance in a large company (greater than 500 employees).

If you choose to document your reasons for resigning, I would not forward your resignation letter via your supervisor who may alter it and/or get ugly. I would suggest that you pay a visit to H.R. and hand deliver the letter to a responsible person yourself and let H.R. tell your supervisor. Of course, some H.R. people and/or departments don't want to deal with the difficult side of being in H.R. and may insist in the letter being forwarded by the chain of command. So it's up to you how you want to handle this and how important it is to you to poke the supervisor in the eye. Today, large companies only confirm employment dates to anyone following up on references and provide no information on work quality so the need to preserve references is very limited.

Amado
Herd Member
Posts: 283
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2015 12:02 am
Location: The richest hill on earth.
Contact:

Re: Help needed with work issue.

Postby Amado » Sun Dec 17, 2017 5:47 pm

Literiding wrote:
Probably a good plan. I would suggest that you might want to document this as one of the reasons you are resigning in your resignation letter. Also, stating that you personally heard the supervisor discriminating against a fellow employee by assigning them disliked tasks exclusively creating in your mind a "hostile" work environment. May not do any good, but in to day's super politically correct work place, it may cause an investigation or at least cause the supervisor to be more closely monitored. In the smaller businesses, it would be a futile effort but it has some chance in a large company (greater than 500 employees).


THIS.

User avatar
Saddlebum
Herd Member
Posts: 218
Joined: Sun Oct 18, 2015 12:28 pm
Location: NW Lower Michigan

Re: Help needed with work issue.

Postby Saddlebum » Sun Dec 17, 2017 7:32 pm

Thank you! I will follow up with H.R. as to make sure my mailing address is reflected with them as well as Payroll so my W-2 and anything else mailed to my home gets to me at my home.

There are over 400k people working for this billion $ co. I'm a lowly grunt and do not expect them to mail me anything thru the co. but do expect mailings to come to my home.

She's trying to flex her muscles and those she does not like, she's intimidating or trying to. Just a few short months ago, she was on an equal plane with us and those she liked at the time are now going into her office and joking it up with her. Those she did not like at the time simply are trying to do their job. Because myself and another newby never worked with her at all, she's enjoying being pushy with us.

There is such a big age difference between us, I try to empathize with her.

User avatar
Chisamba
Bringing Life to the DDBB
Posts: 4452
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2015 10:33 pm
Location: New Jersey

Re: Help needed with work issue.

Postby Chisamba » Sun Dec 17, 2017 11:57 pm

It actually sounds like you resent her age and education. Otherwise there was no need to mention it related to her actions and your need for advice.

I actually left a job for a similar reason. A young pretty person with not much education was promoted into a position as my direct supervisor. I actually left because she came to work drunk and wobbly, clocked in slept in the car and her Co worker covered for her.

I left because of her actions but freely admit I disliked her youth and inexperience.

The thing is I'm pretty old now. And have two. Masters degrees. One in microbiology and one in education. Almost everyone I work for us younger and less educated than I am. But I really appreciate the health insurance of a good company and have given up the expectations of having a good boss.

I now go. Out of my way to compliment my boss on the things she does well, and try not to dwell on things done poorly.

As to mail company mail and personal mail have different criteria. Maybe she was unaware it was personal

Josette
Bringing Life to the DDBB
Posts: 1360
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2015 3:53 pm
Location: NJ

Re: Help needed with work issue.

Postby Josette » Mon Dec 18, 2017 3:27 am

I think this manager's young age combined with her lack of education is why she doesn't act like a professional. Her ignorance about opening someone's personal mail and her spiteful behavior to employees is wrong. Where is HER manager to stop this nonsense? I don't hear the OP resenting this manager - just questioning her bad judgement and behavior. Plus that she is getting away with it.

User avatar
Saddlebum
Herd Member
Posts: 218
Joined: Sun Oct 18, 2015 12:28 pm
Location: NW Lower Michigan

Re: Help needed with work issue.

Postby Saddlebum » Mon Dec 18, 2017 8:37 pm

Her manager is not located at this facility; either is H.R. for that matter (they come here once a month for 2-3 days). I have a call into H.R. in hopes of getting my mailing address on line with all their subcontractors who might send me stuff such as W-2's etc.

I believe that will solve the problem and then H.R. can educate my boss on how to file all the paperwork a newby fills out. I know I filled out a form designating my mailing address different from my street address. The form asked for both. I know I filled out a form that 'opted out' from the retirement program but was not done. Obviously, the forms never made it to the proper offices.

After a week of filling out forms, my file was 1/2 inch thick. So, hoping this will take care of any future mail issues.

Also, I'm looking hard for another job.

User avatar
Saddlebum
Herd Member
Posts: 218
Joined: Sun Oct 18, 2015 12:28 pm
Location: NW Lower Michigan

Re: Help needed with work issue.

Postby Saddlebum » Sat Dec 23, 2017 1:52 am

First, I spoke with the lady at the post office. Because there is a return address, when the mail is returned to the sender, it then becomes the property of the sender again. They have the legal right to open it.

Spoke to my boss today and the other manager was in on the meeting. He did almost all the talking but of course, he's experienced and has the education. As an aside, he is also a ADHAD person (attention deficit hyperactivity disorder) so he could not stop talking. I like him and have respect for him.

He and my boss stated they had the legal right to open my mail. Then we talked about what I had been trying to accomplish and the discussion remained congenial. When my boss spoke, she was irritated and wanted me to know she did not appreciate my going to H.R. I then explained why I went to H.R. to make sure my mail was sent to the right address.

My boss then stated she changed my mailing address on Oct. 2nd and she said the date of the change is right here on my screen. Well, trouble is,the other manager and myself could not see her screen and my start date was Oct. 4th. We didn't know of the problem until a request for reimbursement was submitted and blah blah blah, came back (took 30 days). That is when I tried to get her to look into it for me. Bottom line, my boss did not want it to come out that she blew me off when I asked her to look into it and not once but at least twice and maybe a thrice.

She was focused on my never going to her but going straight to H.R. I did NOT question her statement. The other manager was saying how she is going to be a really good manager some day so I refrained from putting her on the spot bc of his support and her age/inexperience.

Sooooo frustrating...knowing I will be leaving asap, I chose to leave it alone. They can open my mail legally. There will be no more requests for reimbursements and my boss is angry with me.

She cannot conceal it because of her age. I will do the best I can and support her as much as I can but OUT OF THERE as soon as I can.

UGH...

Literiding
Herd Member
Posts: 149
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2015 7:53 pm

Re: Help needed with work issue.

Postby Literiding » Sat Dec 23, 2017 3:44 pm

Something that occurred to me while reading your latest post is that you may have run into a “generation gap” thing. Those who grew up in the ‘70s and ‘80s seem to have a much more developed sense of privacy when compared to the “social media” generation. What is private to you may be of no importance to your supervisor. It is always tough to be a different generation than your boss. Also, if your company is organized like most, your boss is a “line supervisor,” and her boss is a first line manager. Neither are paid to think, only follow directions.


Return to “The Observation Lounge/ Cookbook Forum even Hot Topics”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 50 guests