In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby Moutaineer » Sat Dec 08, 2018 1:06 am

MC. My guess would be that they worked out that friend knew enough to work out that horse was lame/drugged/not as described...

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby khall » Wed Dec 12, 2018 5:13 pm

Xan I know you said no draft crosses and normally I would completely agree with you but I ran across this young mare and man she is a nice one!

https://www.facebook.com/18326015503496 ... tion=group

From this FB site:
https://www.facebook.com/groups/Dressagehorsesforsale/

She may not have any draft in her since she has SWANA papers pending. Spotted Draft is the farm.

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby Xanthoria » Wed Dec 12, 2018 5:32 pm

Thanks khall. See, this is why buying eventers in the US is hard. She's a nice enough looking lower level horse IMO, but does have a big old drafty head and a short neck, and I'm not a huge fan of her walk which looks like it might get lateral if there is tension. She's popping over 2' but it's impossible to say if that's her limit. She's out of a spotted draft mare and by a stallion whose competition record appears to be jumping 3' if I go by the only picture I can find of him in a show ring. So there's nothing in the pedigree that suggest she might go Prelim or more. Total gamble. And she's listed at $29k.

When I am looking at horses in Ireland, they show a horse this age freejumping a 3'6"-4' jump with scope, and they're more like 6-10k sterling. Even if I add flights and import and pay almost the same in the end, I have a horse bred on both sides of the pedigree with proven competition horses who has had a start for that career who I know can clear bigger fences.

So, unless one of the horses I see this weekend blows me away means I'll head to Ireland soon.

Sorry to be so ungrateful!

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby khall » Wed Dec 12, 2018 5:47 pm

Xan no problem! I do agree the price is high for what she is. Who knows what she would end up like. I don't mind the neck or head too much. But hey I'm not shelling out big $ either for a horse. You have every right to stack the deck in your favor.

Funny what you are saying about free jumping. I have a good friend who is Scottish and a fabulous horse person, breeder etc. She was telling me that the big show jumpers in Britain will put a yearling through the shoot with the jump set 5' or so to see what their talent is like. I was shocked, but apparently they are not going to waste their time if the young horse does not have the ability. Not like they are doing this day after day but just a short time to see what the youngsters talent is like.

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby PaulaO » Wed Dec 12, 2018 5:55 pm

Xan, were you able to look at the FB page Sport Horses?

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby Xanthoria » Wed Dec 12, 2018 6:01 pm

Well I don't know about yearlings, but the 2-3 yr olds certainly go thru a chute all around Europe, and the useless ones get sold off. The rest go back in a field til age 4 usually, which is good.

Which really is an annoyance about US sellers. They expect you to buy a pedigree and ride that. Because they WILL NOT send a baby thru a chute a couple of times - so much pearl clutching when I suggest it! "Desperate to sell!" yesterday wouldn't put their long 3 YO thru a chute - not even if I went there and helped them build it. But oh, I'll take 20 grand, yes. And I'll start riding babies at age 2.

I have tried so many ways to ask "so, exactly what makes you think this horse will go minimum prelim?" without offending these people, and the answers range from "well his grandsire on one side jumped competitively" to "I just know - my friend told me"

US buyers and sellers are hugely disadvantaged on the world scene by all this.

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby Xanthoria » Wed Dec 12, 2018 6:05 pm

PaulaO wrote:Xan, were you able to look at the FB page Sport Horses?


Paula is that the whole name of the group? I can't find one with just that name... what am I doing wrong?

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby piedmontfields » Wed Dec 12, 2018 6:45 pm

I think it is Sporthorses for Sale on FB.

Going directly to Ireland and shopping from decent folks who have a variety of talented youngsters is actually the quicker way to get to what you want. And you get to skip the US bull$3!&.

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby Xanthoria » Wed Dec 12, 2018 6:50 pm

thanks piedmont - joining now!

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby PaulaO » Thu Dec 13, 2018 12:37 am

Sport Horses for Sale

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby Fatcat » Thu Dec 13, 2018 5:34 am

musical comedy wrote:I was just reading Xan's post on the other board. It brought to mind a situation my friend just encountered that really sucked. Let me share it with you.

Friend finds a horse she likes that is about 1.5 hours away. Seller is not really a 'dealer', but sort of. I won't bore you with those details.

Seller claims to be very particular about who buys their horses. They ask many questions and the want to see video, etc. etc. The horse in question is a young draft cross that is currently fox hunting. They were asking 25k and friend was ok with that price.

Friend talked on the phone with sellers husband. (He's a rider and a farrier). Friend gets grilled with all the questions. Eventually they claim they are happy with her as a buyer and they like friend's riding on the video.

Friend tries to get an appointment to come see the horse, but sellers keep putting her off with flimsy excuses. Next thing, ad on FB gets removed. Eventually seller's husband calls friend and tells her that they have decided that she is not a good match for the horse. They claim the horse is having some behavior issues, etc. and that it needs a pro. They are going to send it to a pro for a while for training. Ok.

Next thing friend sees the horse up on an auction site. It's one of those auctions that usually doesn't command big bucks. Horse sells on the auction site for 7k.

Now...you tell me what's up with this deal? Friend is the absolute ideal horse owner. Has her own place, has money, is a nice kind rider, etc. etc.

The moral to this story is: horse shopping sucks.


What's up with this deal is that Horse People Are Crazy. :lol:

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby Xanthoria » Sat Dec 15, 2018 2:26 am

Aaand one of the other horse I am seeing this weekend is now in question. Seller informs me she WILL NOT freejump the horse, even tho she has done it before, and won't relent even if I help build/take down the jumps. No reason given. Apparently she's also only allowed 1.5 hours for a trial, and tells me she has a lesson scheduled at the exact time I was meant to arrive.

Clearly priorities are elsewhere (I would guess receiving a monthly training fee is better than the commission...) but flight is paid for, rental car paid for, hotel paid for...

So sick of dealing with this. Another horse I'm seeing the trainer was an absolute nightmare and wouldn't tell me anything - had to get details from the owner directly. Probably the same issue.

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby Fatcat » Sat Dec 15, 2018 3:16 am

Xanthoria wrote:Aaand one of the other horse I am seeing this weekend is now in question. Seller informs me she WILL NOT freejump the horse, even tho she has done it before, and won't relent even if I help build/take down the jumps. No reason given. Apparently she's also only allowed 1.5 hours for a trial, and tells me she has a lesson scheduled at the exact time I was meant to arrive.

Clearly priorities are elsewhere (I would guess receiving a monthly training fee is better than the commission...) but flight is paid for, rental car paid for, hotel paid for...

So sick of dealing with this. Another horse I'm seeing the trainer was an absolute nightmare and wouldn't tell me anything - had to get details from the owner directly. Probably the same issue.


Where in the PNW are you going to be?

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby Xanthoria » Sat Dec 15, 2018 3:21 am

Portland and Tacoma

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby Fatcat » Sat Dec 15, 2018 3:24 am

Xanthoria wrote:Portland and Tacoma


Oh, re-read your postings, got your listed of must-haves. What's the price range?

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby Xanthoria » Sat Dec 15, 2018 4:56 am

30 tops

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby Fatcat » Sat Dec 15, 2018 5:32 am

Xanthoria wrote:30 tops


got it, I'll be in touch via PM if my trainer has something you might want to see while you're here.

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby Xanthoria » Sat Dec 15, 2018 6:32 am

Thank you Fatcat!!! Later Saturday afternoon is free right now...

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby piedmontfields » Sat Dec 15, 2018 12:50 pm

Xan, this is so frustrating. Hope a gem pops up soon.

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby snftrs2 » Sat Dec 15, 2018 6:47 pm

Just thinking of you and sending horse shopping moral support vibes ... i figure that as hard as this search has been, you're overdue to spot a horse you really, really like sometime soon. Fingers crossed.

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby Ryeissa » Sat Dec 15, 2018 7:51 pm

sorry :( that is so disrespectful.

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby Xanthoria » Sat Dec 15, 2018 8:16 pm

Ok leaving OR now. Nice mare! Still don’t know if she can jump higher! But seller agreed to freejump video next week.

On way to WA now...

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby Fatcat » Sun Dec 16, 2018 12:24 am

Hi Xan, My instructor finally got back to me and didn't have anything for you. She did say that her clinician, a trainer from LA (originally Scottish), just made a trip to Ireland for the exact same horse you're looking for and came back empty handed. :(

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby Xanthoria » Sun Dec 16, 2018 1:28 am

Oh heck. Ireland was my fallback plan :(

I do have a solid contact there tho with a few options to see, all 4/5 yo. Perhaps if I can’t afford any of them I should send the videos to you!

Thanks for trying anyway!

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby Fatcat » Sun Dec 16, 2018 1:29 am

Xanthoria wrote:Oh heck. Ireland was my fallback plan :(

I do have a solid contact there tho with a few options to see, all 4/5 yo. Perhaps if I can’t afford any of them I should send the videos to you!

Thanks for trying anyway!


This is what she said:
"It’s crazy. They went to the international event horse auction and nothing fit the bill. They had $75k to spend"

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby Xanthoria » Sun Dec 16, 2018 1:31 am

Whaaaaat??? Come on. Was she looking for a palomino paint 17h with one blue eye that can jump around Badminton tomorrow???

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby Fatcat » Sun Dec 16, 2018 1:32 am

Xanthoria wrote:Whaaaaat??? Come on. Was she looking for a palomino paint 17h with one blue eye that can jump around Badminton tomorrow???


I don't know details. I'm just a lowly dressage rider, I keep all 4 hooves on the ground if possible. 8-)

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby khall » Sun Dec 16, 2018 2:18 am

Xan I know this one is in Ontario, but she is cute. The FB ad has her at $25k not $30. CCS Vanya. http://www.tiaraequine.com/for-sale.html

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby Gwen » Mon Dec 17, 2018 12:03 am

I skipped to the end because people were talking about Ireland looking for eventers - I literally just went a few weekends ago with a friend who was shopping, we saw some great horses and worked with a really awesome agent who did a lot of leg work to weed through options and came up with some very good prospects, one of which my friend bought and he’s coming home next week! The most fun trip too, David was great to work with, absolutely no pressure, pleasant and straightforward, he had his top picks trailer to his farm for our first day, then he took us around to a few other farms as well.

PM me and I’m happy to pass on the agent, also the woman who bred the horse she bought!

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby Xanthoria » Mon Dec 17, 2018 2:11 am

Well I’m leaving Seattle-Tacoma as soon as the plane stops being delayed...

Roundup of weekend shopping:
Saturday:
1. Green 4yo, very average gaits, great jumping attitude and a sweetie but scope TBD
2. Cancelled this horse due to arthritis

Sunday:
3. 6yo with lovely gaits and brave jump but a... questionable ridden attitude
4. Below height 4yo, very hot, very catty, lovely gaits, extremely green to the jumps so scope TBD
5. Large and forward 4yo but perhaps not thinking (?) like #4. Not my type, but a gorgeous big pinto WB hunk!
6. 14yo prelim packer was offered at one showing. I got contact details, video, and ran a hand over his legs. Seems intelligent, gaits not exciting but am told he scores well. Intriguing...

These are all priced $12-25k. And TBH if I wanted to go Novice/Training I’d be happy to take ALL of them home tomorrow! But I want to go further.

Lots to think about...

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby heddylamar » Mon Dec 17, 2018 3:48 am

TBH, from one "ridden prelim" to another, I'd only consider #4, and possibly #1 from your list. You don't appear to be a big person, so small doesn't bother me (I'm 5'7" and competed a 15H QH at prelim), but, as annoying as it is, I'd keep shopping.

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby khall » Mon Dec 17, 2018 4:40 am

Is the big pinto WB the one that I had found on FB that was such a nice mover?

Good luck, sounds like Gwen can help you re Ireland.

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby musical comedy » Mon Dec 17, 2018 1:37 pm

Aren't there horses that have a willing big jump, but still wouldn't be suitable for eventing? For example, do you think most 4 ft jumpers (or hunters) could easily transition over to eventing? I don't know how to judge whether a young horse would be suitable for eventing. Just jumping high and in good form through a chute can only tell you so much. If I were looking for a higher level event prospect, I'd want something that has been out there either foxhunting or eventing at a lower level.

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby Xanthoria » Mon Dec 17, 2018 6:39 pm

yes mc - you're right. Not all jumpers are brave enough to even, or have the gaits to score well in dressage, or have the body type to make time across country! So its taking everything into account, but without a scopy jump, forget it - unless you want to stay at Novice or Training.

So for me, decent gaits, a good jump and the right attitude is what I look for.

In the US, my price range means a started greenie or a much older horse. A baby is a risk - may never make it. Older horse might not do it for long at all. I've experienced both.

In the UK/Ireland, I can get a horse going the equivalent of Training or even Prelim for about the same price.

heddylamar #4 is my pick. But boy I would love to have #1 as well, for kicks. However neither of them is ready for BN let alone anything else.

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby StraightForward » Mon Dec 17, 2018 6:51 pm

If #4 is smallish and hot, he will probably be on the market for a while, so at least that is one in your back pocket while you keep shopping.

Did the trip at least help you hone in on what you need (not that you don't have a specific set of criteria already)?
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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby Xanthoria » Mon Dec 17, 2018 6:58 pm

Added to that StraightForward, but #4 is a chestnut mare and actually 3, not 4! So hopefully no rush there as that combo appears to be the kiss of death for horse sales ;) She spent half her lunge warmup on her hind legs! :lol: (I really like her!)

Yes I think it did refine my needs. I am placing a higher value on good attitude and jump scope, in that order. But if I don't see what's available in Ireland I don't think I can make the call.

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby Xanthoria » Thu Dec 20, 2018 10:29 pm

This just in: horse for sale, going Prelim, 9yo. Advertised as having kissing spines. $20k price tag. LULZ.

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby musical comedy » Thu Dec 20, 2018 10:46 pm

Xanthoria wrote:This just in: horse for sale, going Prelim, 9yo. Advertised as having kissing spines. $20k price tag. LULZ.
Trying to figure out if you are kidding or interested?

Have you seen this one: http://sporthorsenation.eventingnation. ... -prospect/

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby Xanthoria » Thu Dec 20, 2018 11:20 pm

NOT interested - shocked at the price actually!

That horse looks nice: I've sent them an email :)

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby Ryeissa » Fri Dec 21, 2018 2:38 pm

Xanthoria wrote:shocked at the price actually!


Same!
kissing spines....yuck. no way. That is a free horse, most likely....just randomly guessing

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby Josette » Fri Dec 21, 2018 6:11 pm


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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby Xanthoria » Fri Dec 21, 2018 6:29 pm

Josette he does look like a nice boy. Listed as a KWPN but his sire Whiskei is a Dutch harness horse, and the dam? Her name is Downylands Daisy - I wonder what she is. I wonder how they do in eventing? No performance record to be seen for sire or dam.

Seller is in Scottdale AZ but her 13 "KWPN" horses for sale are in KY, OR, IL, Az... hmmm...? Odd.

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby Josette » Fri Dec 21, 2018 6:36 pm

I agree - yes it sounds odd. His large size and quiet temperament caught my attention compared to some of the others you had mentioned. Yup - shopping still sucks.

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby Xanthoria » Fri Dec 21, 2018 6:56 pm

End of the day tho, he can jump! :D

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby heddylamar » Fri Dec 21, 2018 8:36 pm

Xanthoria wrote:End of the day tho, he can jump! :D


And not break his neck when he gets stuck in weird situations!

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby redsoxluvr » Sat Dec 22, 2018 3:25 am

Xanthoria wrote:Josette he does look like a nice boy. Listed as a KWPN but his sire Whiskei is a Dutch harness horse, and the dam? Her name is Downylands Daisy - I wonder what she is. I wonder how they do in eventing? No performance record to be seen for sire or dam.

Seller is in Scottdale AZ but her 13 "KWPN" horses for sale are in KY, OR, IL, Az... hmmm...? Odd.


The seller is local to AZ but gets her DHH horses from KY and such. She has a few on her FB page that are quite scopey - have you seen them?
As an aside, if there is something you are interested in, I may be able to preview it for you.

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby khall » Sat Dec 22, 2018 4:06 am

I really like that KWPN/DHH cross gelding. He looks like he could really gallop and jump which is exactly what you need for CC. The one MC posted is a nice horse as well, a bit more polished.

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby scruffy the cat » Sat Dec 22, 2018 4:36 am

DHHs are registered by KWPN, same as Dutch Warmbloods. Same overseeing body. Many DHHs can jump very well but their movement isn't usually efficient enough for XC and they often have wonky canters since they are trotting horses mainly. A good DHH cross can do a lot of different things. I'd scrutinize video carefully.

edited to add: I just watched the video and I don't care for him at all as an eventer. He lacks the efficiency of movement on the flat and over fences that a good eventer needs. There's just so much superfluous action in both trot and canter- he'd never make time on more advanced courses.

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Re: In which I'm reminded how much horse shopping sucks!

Postby khall » Sat Dec 22, 2018 5:13 am

Scruffy Xan is talking about going Prelim, I had a 15.1 hh mutt of a horse that could make time at Prelim. Going advanced is another thing, but Prelim is not that challenging to make time.

I like this young horse because he is game and like josette said he seems to have a great brain. He got put into some not so good spots in the jumping video and he went anyway. He is scopey and picks up his legs nicely.


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