Insurance-- yes or no

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Fatcat
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Insurance-- yes or no

Postby Fatcat » Mon Mar 26, 2018 7:10 pm

So I've had my mare insured since I got her 5 years ago. Just renewed and got a note back saying policy was renewed but underwriter excluded L hock arthritis. She had X-rays last year which found some mild changes to her left hock. She is sound.

Is this the way it's going to go, anything that occurs gets excluded to eventually it's worthless? My cat has better insurance than my horse, at a fraction of the cost. And he's an expensive cat with an autoimmune condition.

Is insurance really worth it?
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Hayburner
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Re: Insurance-- yes or no

Postby Hayburner » Tue Mar 27, 2018 12:29 am

I have always insured. My first horse, I never filed a claim..he was cancelled due to age.

My newish horse, did have an injury right at the time of my renewal. They came back and said they they have changed the way they are insuring and that if she want being insured at 30k or more they were not interested and by the way the injured leg was excluded from coverage. I will say that since you have 90 days after a policy expires to file claims, they were excellent in covering my claims and the adjusters were super!

I did find coverage elsewhere but they also excluded that leg. When I filled out the paperwork I did state that she is back in work and all is fine. Possibly down the road they may add the leg back in.

As for your horses arthritic hock, people swear by Equithrive. The specialist recommended it and I've kept my mare on it, I have also started giving it to my 31 year old and I think it's helped loosen him upnd getting up seems a bit easier

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Fatcat
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Re: Insurance-- yes or no

Postby Fatcat » Tue Mar 27, 2018 3:10 am

She's on Equithrive's Metabarol product and gets 7 doses of Adequan twice a year. She's sound and doing great.
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Kyra's Mom
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Re: Insurance-- yes or no

Postby Kyra's Mom » Tue Mar 27, 2018 3:55 am

I started "self" insuring years ago after I dutifully report every ding (several on a silly 2 y.o.) a choke episode and a melanoma removal (yes on a 2 y.o.). Never filed a claim. Well the next year, I think her only covered body parts were her front legs. No chance to get a vet exam to assure them all the dings were healed and she was sound. Just nope...not covering. I just said enough. I also want control of what I deem important and what I can swing for treatments. I board, I work full time and what I can do to address certain issues may not be enough for the insurance company. They will tell you you have to do XZY or they will not cover some things. I had some seed money and have put all my premium money in the "critter" account since then and now have a nice healthy bank account for veterinary needs should they arise.

Kyra turns 16 this year so kind of a moot point as she is aging out of (reasonable) insurance.

Susan
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Fatcat
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Re: Insurance-- yes or no

Postby Fatcat » Tue Mar 27, 2018 4:13 am

Kyra's Mom wrote:I started "self" insuring years ago after I dutifully report every ding (several on a silly 2 y.o.) a choke episode and a melanoma removal (yes on a 2 y.o.). Never filed a claim. Well the next year, I think her only covered body parts were her front legs. No chance to get a vet exam to assure them all the dings were healed and she was sound. Just nope...not covering. I just said enough. I also want control of what I deem important and what I can swing for treatments. I board, I work full time and what I can do to address certain issues may not be enough for the insurance company. They will tell you you have to do XZY or they will not cover some things. I had some seed money and have put all my premium money in the "critter" account since then and now have a nice healthy bank account for veterinary needs should they arise.

Kyra turns 16 this year so kind of a moot point as she is aging out of (reasonable) insurance.

Susan

This is exactly what I'm considering doing. When you start counting the exclusions, required necropsy for mortality payout it doesn't seem like such a good deal.
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Re: Insurance-- yes or no

Postby piedmontfields » Tue Mar 27, 2018 12:18 pm

My horse is priceless to me; not so much to anyone else, as she is:

-Unregistered
-Old (16)
-Has a small show record (she is trained well beyond it but that doesn't count)
-Has PSSM

Her insurance is me and my money and smart decisions on her care.

If I bought a fancy 5 yr old, I would insure---at least for awhile! It would help spread out some big costs like purchase price and major surgery over a longer period of time.

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Re: Insurance-- yes or no

Postby Fatcat » Tue Mar 27, 2018 3:28 pm

Horse insurance is turning out to be a big dud. I originally bought it because my mare was 3 states away in MT at her breeder and due to snow I couldn't pick her up for several months. I continued it after the first year because I was so happy with my cat and dog's insurance and expected the same level of service. Now I'm seriously wondering why I did it. She wasn't an expensive horse, she's currently valued at $7500. I was thinking of the expensive treatment and diagnostics that are available like IRAP and stem cell. But if they're going to keep excluding everything that ever happens which is normal stuff like hock arthritis, I wonder why I'm still paying them instead of putting it into a horse account. :(
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Hayburner
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Re: Insurance-- yes or no

Postby Hayburner » Tue Mar 27, 2018 5:53 pm

Now you guys have me re-thinking my actual need for insurance. I do have money put away for even major surgery (knock on wood here).
She's insured for 15K . She's 8 and I think I may end up keeping it for a few more years and see how it goes.

Fatcat - My mare did need many x-rays and ultrasound - before my insurance ran out ( I had a total of 4K that I could use) I did also have Irap treatments done on her. I didn't end up using the full 4K - but, it I did use a lot more than my premium and my deductible was only $400.

As for Irap - I heard that now, they only need one treatment rather than the 5 or more that was used in the past. I don't know if the cost went down, but I would guess that it did.

I have a friend that has had to have exams, x-rays, ultrasound, 2 MRI's, shockwave and goodness what else, she was glad she had the insurance to cover all of it.

I have other friends, that have had extensive exams, treatments, etc and they don't file a claim - they are afraid they will get exclusions. I have to wonder if when they fill out the renewal paperwork if they don't list these exams and treatments.

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Fatcat
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Re: Insurance-- yes or no

Postby Fatcat » Tue Mar 27, 2018 5:58 pm

Hayburner wrote:I have other friends, that have had extensive exams, treatments, etc and they don't file a claim - they are afraid they will get exclusions. I have to wonder if when they fill out the renewal paperwork if they don't list these exams and treatments.


My policy says that if you don't list the exams/diagnosis/treatments you run the risk of not having future things such as mortality claims or major medical covered. It's best to be forthcoming or you could void your policy.

I think next year I'll not renew and set up a Retta account. She's a Morgan and is very hardy and healthy, never had an injury or illness in the 5 years I've had her, (of course now that I say that she'll have something catastrophic happen). :roll:
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Re: Insurance-- yes or no

Postby heddylamar » Wed Mar 28, 2018 12:44 am

Credit card and savings.

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Re: Insurance-- yes or no

Postby Nikiwink » Wed Mar 28, 2018 2:26 am

After watching numerous friends have exclusion after exclusion added Ive never bothered. I always try and have a savings account for the animals or credit card if desperate (and managable etc).

Ive previously self funded colic surgery (didnt have the money and wasnt going to but my partner at time said he'd foot it... He didnt....long story). But i still had that 5 figure bill paid back to the vet before the horses 3mth recovery was finished.

From what ive seen its just not worth having.

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Re: Insurance-- yes or no

Postby khall » Wed Mar 28, 2018 2:34 am

i've had exclusions, still do. 3 of my 4 are insured. Colic surgery is expensive ($8000 or so), many vet procedures are pricey and the medical has helped tremendously over the years. It is annoying that any little ding (my filly has a splint LF from being run into the fence) will lead to an exclusion. I've even had the vets write letters when the problem has resolved and still they will exclude. But it would be hard to come up with the money to replace Rip or my filly Joplin. I don't have 5 figures roaming around to drop onto a horse of similar training or movement. So mine will continue to be insured for the foreseeable future.

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Re: Insurance-- yes or no

Postby Hayburner » Wed Mar 28, 2018 1:37 pm

Fatcat - I do give my friends the raised eyebrow look when they say they are not reporting/filing a claim for medical issues that they have even gone to a specialist for....I would think if the carrier found out they could not only void your policy - they could file fraud charges..Your Morgan mare must be hardy like my 1/2 Arab gelding - all those years I paid for coverage and never used it - he never had a colic episode until he was in his mid 20's - which luckily has always been resolved with a little banamine.

If all we were concerned about was colic surgery (knocking on wood here) - why not go the less expensive route and go on Smartpak supplements that give you coverage?

Do we want to open this conversation as to what company we use, coverage amount and what we pay in premiums?

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Fatcat
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Re: Insurance-- yes or no

Postby Fatcat » Wed Mar 28, 2018 4:35 pm

Hayburner wrote:Fatcat - I do give my friends the raised eyebrow look when they say they are not reporting/filing a claim for medical issues that they have even gone to a specialist for....I would think if the carrier found out they could not only void your policy - they could file fraud charges..Your Morgan mare must be hardy like my 1/2 Arab gelding - all those years I paid for coverage and never used it - he never had a colic episode until he was in his mid 20's - which luckily has always been resolved with a little banamine.

If all we were concerned about was colic surgery (knocking on wood here) - why not go the less expensive route and go on Smartpak supplements that give you coverage?

Do we want to open this conversation as to what company we use, coverage amount and what we pay in premiums?


I do have SP's ColicCare on my two ponies. I also have it on retta unintentionally, as she's on SmartDigest Ultra and it comes along with that.

I use Equisure, underwritten by Hartford. Coverage is $7500 major med/mortality and it costs about $550/year. It's not so much colic I insure for, but expensive diagnostics and treatments. I've been fortunate to only have one colic in 43 years of horse ownership, and that was for a 29yo with a severe heart problem.
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Moutaineer
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Re: Insurance-- yes or no

Postby Moutaineer » Thu Mar 29, 2018 3:14 am

I dropped it this year on Laddie. They didn't pay a cent of his extensive vet bills last year, and then excluded the stifle, and put the premium up to an eyewatering amount.

I looked at doing just mortality, but the kicker with that is that they include a certain amount towards colic surgery, which, in the event of a colic, you would then have to have performed in order to receive the mortality payment, and the difference between what they were paying and the actual cost of the surgery was quite significant (to say nothing of the fact that I wouldn't be doing colic surgery on a 16 year old horse anyway.)

So, I'm on the cross your fingers self insurance scheme. But apparently I was last year, but just paying for the privilege.

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Re: Insurance-- yes or no

Postby khall » Mon Apr 02, 2018 4:48 pm

Mountaineer why did they not pay anything on his stifle? It was injury related and not re-existing if I remember correctly. That is just ridiculous. Yes not all insurance companies nor the underwriters are created equally.


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